Comments on: Milken Institute Takes Issue With My Post http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my.html Sun, 22 Nov 2009 13:16:39 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: Chicago Boss http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my.html#comment-7604 Chicago Boss Tue, 06 May 2008 03:35:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my-post/#comment-7604 I am not attending the **Milken Conference** again and not supporting anyone else to do so either as a consequence of the response to Yves' posting of the Milken Ilk's disciplinary email. The reason why big media is becoming irrelevant is because bloggers generate real news with analysis that is relevant. You make it sound like a real speculator needs inside information to succeed in this game of wealth transfer. Your "friends"...oops conspirators (sorry) aren't real players if that's the case.<br/><br/>Real players don't trade on non-public information because you never know when it's your turn to be the mark until it's too late.<br/><br/>Get out before you go to jail.<br/><br/>Keep it up Yves, we appreciate "bloggeristic" integrity. touche I am not attending the **Milken Conference** again and not supporting anyone else to do so either as a consequence of the response to Yves’ posting of the Milken Ilk’s disciplinary email. The reason why big media is becoming irrelevant is because bloggers generate real news with analysis that is relevant. You make it sound like a real speculator needs inside information to succeed in this game of wealth transfer. Your “friends”…oops conspirators (sorry) aren’t real players if that’s the case.

Real players don’t trade on non-public information because you never know when it’s your turn to be the mark until it’s too late.

Get out before you go to jail.

Keep it up Yves, we appreciate “bloggeristic” integrity. touche

]]> By: mort_fin http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my.html#comment-7602 mort_fin Tue, 06 May 2008 01:42:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my-post/#comment-7602 Milken is not above advocating 'government' if someone who wants 'government' is sponsoring the research. Consider the Milken report on down payment assistance, where they tout the benefits of the Nehemiah program, which relies on FHA, since the private sector won't touch them, and costs the taxpayer about $1 billion a year according to HUD's latest actual review (the next one will probably peg the cost a lot higher). And what is their metric for program 'success?' Why, the amount of taxes paid to local governments. So much for the private sector, not government, meme. http://www.milkeninstitute.org/publications/publications.taf?function=detail&ID=306&cat=ResRep<br/><br/>And on the subject of groupthink at Milken, consider this gem from their 2003 real estate conference:<br/>http://www.milkeninstitute.org/events/events.taf?function=show&cat=allconf&EventID=GC03&level1=program&level2=agenda&EvID=257&ID=26<br/><br/>Summary:<br/>After the stock market bubble burst in 2000, real estate has regained its position as the “gold” standard of the 21st century. Moderator Joel Kotkin began the session by pointing out that real estate investment surpassed investment in equities and asked panelists if this trend would hold and attract more investors in coming years. Indeed, panelists agreed that today’s real estate market is not a short-term boom ... Milken is not above advocating ‘government’ if someone who wants ‘government’ is sponsoring the research. Consider the Milken report on down payment assistance, where they tout the benefits of the Nehemiah program, which relies on FHA, since the private sector won’t touch them, and costs the taxpayer about $1 billion a year according to HUD’s latest actual review (the next one will probably peg the cost a lot higher). And what is their metric for program ’success?’ Why, the amount of taxes paid to local governments. So much for the private sector, not government, meme. http://www.milkeninstitute.org/publications/publications.taf?function=detail&ID=306&cat=ResRep

And on the subject of groupthink at Milken, consider this gem from their 2003 real estate conference:
http://www.milkeninstitute.org/events/events.taf?function=show&cat=allconf&EventID=GC03&level1=program&level2=agenda&EvID=257&ID=26

Summary:
After the stock market bubble burst in 2000, real estate has regained its position as the “gold” standard of the 21st century. Moderator Joel Kotkin began the session by pointing out that real estate investment surpassed investment in equities and asked panelists if this trend would hold and attract more investors in coming years. Indeed, panelists agreed that today’s real estate market is not a short-term boom …

]]> By: heavyhitter http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my.html#comment-7600 heavyhitter Tue, 06 May 2008 00:11:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my-post/#comment-7600 Where do you get this "bloggers expect the same access and privileges as the MSM" from? I read a fair number of blogs and don't recall any blog I read asking for or demanding it. Aside from a court case or two where a blogger tried to protect his sources, I can't think of an example. How many blogs are there? Millions? But you attribute the demand on a specific issue of a microscopic minority caught up in litigation to broad claims by all of them. A rather curious thought process.<br/><br/>As for privacy, it's a fact that e-mails get forwarded and used out of context. Anyone who sends something via that medium ought to know that and if they regard something as private, say so. Many firms and individuals now have language to that effect on all their e-mails. Again, I don't see the big deal here. Felix Salmon thought her defense was worth printing, and I would say she made a good case given a poor fact set. She comported herself well, which is the important thing. Where do you get this “bloggers expect the same access and privileges as the MSM” from? I read a fair number of blogs and don’t recall any blog I read asking for or demanding it. Aside from a court case or two where a blogger tried to protect his sources, I can’t think of an example. How many blogs are there? Millions? But you attribute the demand on a specific issue of a microscopic minority caught up in litigation to broad claims by all of them. A rather curious thought process.

As for privacy, it’s a fact that e-mails get forwarded and used out of context. Anyone who sends something via that medium ought to know that and if they regard something as private, say so. Many firms and individuals now have language to that effect on all their e-mails. Again, I don’t see the big deal here. Felix Salmon thought her defense was worth printing, and I would say she made a good case given a poor fact set. She comported herself well, which is the important thing.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my.html#comment-7597 Anonymous Mon, 05 May 2008 23:20:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my-post/#comment-7597 Yves Smith's response to the Milken email illustrates perfectly the problem with bloggers, who tend to demand the same treatment and access as mainstream media. <br/>Printing that email was entirely wrong and saying you had waiting 48 hours for a response was no excuse in any way. As a blogger who writes for a sizeable audience, you have a responsibility to the people you correspond with. They should be allowed to write to you without fearing that their words be printed in public forum. And yet you have abused that trust, which may explain why bloggers generally fail to get the access they believe they deserve. Yves Smith’s response to the Milken email illustrates perfectly the problem with bloggers, who tend to demand the same treatment and access as mainstream media.
Printing that email was entirely wrong and saying you had waiting 48 hours for a response was no excuse in any way. As a blogger who writes for a sizeable audience, you have a responsibility to the people you correspond with. They should be allowed to write to you without fearing that their words be printed in public forum. And yet you have abused that trust, which may explain why bloggers generally fail to get the access they believe they deserve.

]]> By: Chicago Boss http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my.html#comment-7593 Chicago Boss Mon, 05 May 2008 19:49:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my-post/#comment-7593 Re: Food Chain<br/><br/>I eat dinosaurs for breakfast. You don't get big eating lentils, stick to chicken, fish, bison, and elk.<br/><br/>I will tip your canoe with my breath as you all lean to the same side. Re: Food Chain

I eat dinosaurs for breakfast. You don’t get big eating lentils, stick to chicken, fish, bison, and elk.

I will tip your canoe with my breath as you all lean to the same side.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my.html#comment-7592 Anonymous Mon, 05 May 2008 19:38:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my-post/#comment-7592 This type of situation will become a large issue in the future, which amounts to fragmentation and censorship.<br/><br/>Many months ago at another blog sight, there was great interest in making people of software called greasemonkey, which can act as a censor tool in the blog world. The reason some use it, is to ignore troll-like posters that may offend people that feel as if they are at the top of the food chain.<br/><br/>That food chain issue is a matter of belonging to the same mindset and thinking -- just like everyone on the team. Membership in this club depends on agreeing to agree with fellow members, and if you make a choice to not think as the group collective, then apparently this is where censorship, greasemonkey technology and fragmentation of society morph into a new form of isolationism, where debate is not allowed or tolerated.<br/><br/>If you dont belong to the right group, you need to find people that agree with you, and i think we can all agree on that, just as we can agree that censorship helps keep us focused and narrow minded. This type of situation will become a large issue in the future, which amounts to fragmentation and censorship.

Many months ago at another blog sight, there was great interest in making people of software called greasemonkey, which can act as a censor tool in the blog world. The reason some use it, is to ignore troll-like posters that may offend people that feel as if they are at the top of the food chain.

That food chain issue is a matter of belonging to the same mindset and thinking — just like everyone on the team. Membership in this club depends on agreeing to agree with fellow members, and if you make a choice to not think as the group collective, then apparently this is where censorship, greasemonkey technology and fragmentation of society morph into a new form of isolationism, where debate is not allowed or tolerated.

If you dont belong to the right group, you need to find people that agree with you, and i think we can all agree on that, just as we can agree that censorship helps keep us focused and narrow minded.

]]> By: Green Eagle http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my.html#comment-7591 Green Eagle Mon, 05 May 2008 19:01:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my-post/#comment-7591 Why should we waste any time responding to the claims of an "institute" founded with stolen money by a monstrous criminal? Yes, Michael Milken, we haven't forgotten who you are. Go away. You have nothing to contribute toward making this a better place to live. Why should we waste any time responding to the claims of an “institute” founded with stolen money by a monstrous criminal? Yes, Michael Milken, we haven’t forgotten who you are. Go away. You have nothing to contribute toward making this a better place to live.

]]> By: Chicago Boss http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my.html#comment-7584 Chicago Boss Mon, 05 May 2008 16:39:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my-post/#comment-7584 A few thoughts:<br/><br/>1) No one needs to defend working for McKinsey...period. If you have a contention with M & Co. you better be consistent and apply that argument to every other firm that dreams of being M & Co.<br/>2) Milken and his ilk derive their edge from cornering and obfuscating the credit market...good job, you will lose!<br/>3) You want private solutions, but where were you when the Fed backed JPM's take-under of Bear Stearns? I don't remember hearing any outcry from the Milken ilk.<br/>4) Reality is not binary. The hybrid solution for BSC was nationalization and auctioning off the assets to private market participants. Instead we gift-wrapped BSC for Dimon.<br/>5) Keep preaching, you are anything but intimidating and should learn not to fight the tape. You too will lose. A few thoughts:

1) No one needs to defend working for McKinsey…period. If you have a contention with M & Co. you better be consistent and apply that argument to every other firm that dreams of being M & Co.
2) Milken and his ilk derive their edge from cornering and obfuscating the credit market…good job, you will lose!
3) You want private solutions, but where were you when the Fed backed JPM’s take-under of Bear Stearns? I don’t remember hearing any outcry from the Milken ilk.
4) Reality is not binary. The hybrid solution for BSC was nationalization and auctioning off the assets to private market participants. Instead we gift-wrapped BSC for Dimon.
5) Keep preaching, you are anything but intimidating and should learn not to fight the tape. You too will lose.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my.html#comment-7583 Anonymous Mon, 05 May 2008 16:27:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my-post/#comment-7583 Very true, anonymous 11.38. Dead and dying lawns across America speak their silent reproach. <br/><br/>As for the touchy conference organizer, her analogy is in itself "a bit disingenuous". No, no one goes to conferences expecting to buy aquarium pumps. They go expecting open and honest dialogue, including, at times, open and honest disagreement.<br/><br/>Right/write on, Yves. You the man. Very true, anonymous 11.38. Dead and dying lawns across America speak their silent reproach.

As for the touchy conference organizer, her analogy is in itself “a bit disingenuous”. No, no one goes to conferences expecting to buy aquarium pumps. They go expecting open and honest dialogue, including, at times, open and honest disagreement.

Right/write on, Yves. You the man.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my.html#comment-7580 Anonymous Mon, 05 May 2008 15:38:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/05/milken-institute-takes-issue-with-my-post/#comment-7580 if we are really, really lucky, the most conspicuous evidence of the efficacy of structured finance, for the next couple of years at least, is going to be ten million vacant Americsn houses. <br/><br/>49 1/2 if we are really, really lucky, the most conspicuous evidence of the efficacy of structured finance, for the next couple of years at least, is going to be ten million vacant Americsn houses.

49 1/2

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