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	<title>Comments on: Kiss Those Dividends Goodbye</title>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/11/kiss-those-dividends-goodbye.html#comment-27358</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Nov 2008 05:41:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>From 1871 to 1958, dividend yields were higher than bond yields; from 1958 to just recently, they were lower.  See &lt;a HREF=&quot;http://ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/?p=18150&quot; REL=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;FT Alphaville&lt;/a&gt; and the &lt;a HREF=&quot;http://www.investorsinsight.com/blogs/john_mauldins_outside_the_box/archive/2008/11/03/two-little-noted-features-of-the-markets-and-the-economy.aspx&quot; REL=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;article they cite&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From 1871 to 1958, dividend yields were higher than bond yields; from 1958 to just recently, they were lower.  See <a HREF="http://ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/?p=18150" REL="nofollow">FT Alphaville</a> and the <a HREF="http://www.investorsinsight.com/blogs/john_mauldins_outside_the_box/archive/2008/11/03/two-little-noted-features-of-the-markets-and-the-economy.aspx" REL="nofollow">article they cite</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: doc holiday</title>
		<link>http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/11/kiss-those-dividends-goodbye.html#comment-27298</link>
		<dc:creator>doc holiday</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 19:27:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Pimco fund may delay payment of November dividend&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;The Pimco California Municipal Income Fund II said Wednesday it may be forced to delay the payment of its November dividend, as well as the declaration of its next scheduled dividend due to severe market disruptions.&lt;br/&gt;http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/081126/ p...d_dividend.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pimco fund may delay payment of November dividend</p>
<p>The Pimco California Municipal Income Fund II said Wednesday it may be forced to delay the payment of its November dividend, as well as the declaration of its next scheduled dividend due to severe market disruptions.<br /><a href="http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/081126/" rel="nofollow">http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/081126/</a> p&#8230;d_dividend.html</p>
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		<title>By: ndk</title>
		<link>http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/11/kiss-those-dividends-goodbye.html#comment-27296</link>
		<dc:creator>ndk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 18:39:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;i&gt;The geniuses that administer our public companies have spent a lot of cash buying back company stock at the top of the bull market, only to sell stocks or cut dividends when prices are severely depressed.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;You&#039;re right, Tortoise.  I also worry about the deeper implications that corporations saw fit only to buy back stock during the best times, having seen no more useful way to spend or reinvest it.  Was that a result of compensation structures, or a sign that trend growth in our economy has slowed badly?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>The geniuses that administer our public companies have spent a lot of cash buying back company stock at the top of the bull market, only to sell stocks or cut dividends when prices are severely depressed.</i></p>
<p>You&#8217;re right, Tortoise.  I also worry about the deeper implications that corporations saw fit only to buy back stock during the best times, having seen no more useful way to spend or reinvest it.  Was that a result of compensation structures, or a sign that trend growth in our economy has slowed badly?</p>
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		<title>By: Tortoise</title>
		<link>http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/11/kiss-those-dividends-goodbye.html#comment-27290</link>
		<dc:creator>Tortoise</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 18:09:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/11/kiss-those-dividends-goodbye/#comment-27290</guid>
		<description>The geniuses that administer our public companies have spent a lot of cash buying back company stock at the top of the bull market, only to sell stocks or cut dividends when prices are severely depressed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The geniuses that administer our public companies have spent a lot of cash buying back company stock at the top of the bull market, only to sell stocks or cut dividends when prices are severely depressed.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/11/kiss-those-dividends-goodbye.html#comment-27277</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 16:44:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Some talk like this is normal market action. It might be normal action for a depression. Even if markets front run a recovery by 6 months to a year by bottoming before the consumer bottoms, you have a few years to go yet.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;This time around, the markets are going to be injected (continued) with liquidity that will blow your mind. Share prices and markets should go up due to the prop job but the value of the dollar will wipe out any gains......This is called hyper-inflation. Not a bubble but pure lack of confidence in a currency. &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Happens all the time. Past, present and future.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;http://radio.goldseek.com/sinclairnuggetnov25.mp3</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Some talk like this is normal market action. It might be normal action for a depression. Even if markets front run a recovery by 6 months to a year by bottoming before the consumer bottoms, you have a few years to go yet.</p>
<p>This time around, the markets are going to be injected (continued) with liquidity that will blow your mind. Share prices and markets should go up due to the prop job but the value of the dollar will wipe out any gains&#8230;&#8230;This is called hyper-inflation. Not a bubble but pure lack of confidence in a currency. </p>
<p>Happens all the time. Past, present and future.</p>
<p><a href="http://radio.goldseek.com/sinclairnuggetnov25.mp3" rel="nofollow">http://radio.goldseek.com/sinclairnuggetnov25.mp3</a></p>
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		<title>By: Andy</title>
		<link>http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/11/kiss-those-dividends-goodbye.html#comment-27267</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 15:34:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/11/kiss-those-dividends-goodbye/#comment-27267</guid>
		<description>Taking a bit of a contrarian view, I do think that some dividend paying stocks are still worth considering. Just today I &lt;a HREF=&quot;http://www.savingtoinvest.com/2008/11/top-dividend-stocks-in-down-market.html&quot; REL=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;wrote a post of five high dividend stocks &lt;/a&gt; I like - T, KO, LLY, AEP and D - all solid companies with good dividend yields. Lets not write stocks like these off now. Infact for long term investors, I think now is the time to get in.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Taking a bit of a contrarian view, I do think that some dividend paying stocks are still worth considering. Just today I <a HREF="http://www.savingtoinvest.com/2008/11/top-dividend-stocks-in-down-market.html" REL="nofollow">wrote a post of five high dividend stocks </a> I like &#8211; T, KO, LLY, AEP and D &#8211; all solid companies with good dividend yields. Lets not write stocks like these off now. Infact for long term investors, I think now is the time to get in.</p>
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		<title>By: JP</title>
		<link>http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/11/kiss-those-dividends-goodbye.html#comment-27246</link>
		<dc:creator>JP</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 12:08:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;i&gt;Some have argued that stocks are cheap because S&amp;P dividend yields are higher than Treasury yields.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Likewise for the articles arguing that stocks are cheap because P/E is low:  Invariably, no one is using realistic forward estimates for that earning denominator.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Some have argued that stocks are cheap because S&amp;P dividend yields are higher than Treasury yields.</i></p>
<p>Likewise for the articles arguing that stocks are cheap because P/E is low:  Invariably, no one is using realistic forward estimates for that earning denominator.</p>
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		<title>By: ndk</title>
		<link>http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/11/kiss-those-dividends-goodbye.html#comment-27232</link>
		<dc:creator>ndk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 10:08:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/11/kiss-those-dividends-goodbye/#comment-27232</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;During a credit crunch the last thing you want to be doing is paying out dividends to shareholders. You want to conserve that cash for acquisitions.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;As a corporation, you&#039;re right.  As an investor, that&#039;s precisely when you do want the dividends, so you too can reinvest them cheaply.  As a laid-off commenter here ruefully pointed out, dollar cost averaging when you only get paid and receive dividends during the good times is a real screwjob.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;i&gt;Anyway, buying equity is definitely a gamble in this environment but with prices the way they are, you can come out way ahead if you pick winners.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Just be careful.  Every fundamental metric you&#039;d use to value these securities must be treated as suspect in this environment, including dividend yield.  If the worst should happen, you absorb all losses first.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;If you feel bullish, you might apply your instincts to buying junk bonds or convertibles instead.  They&#039;re at record wides to Treasuries, and in the unlikely event of bankruptcy, you&#039;re in a much better position.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>During a credit crunch the last thing you want to be doing is paying out dividends to shareholders. You want to conserve that cash for acquisitions.</i></p>
<p>As a corporation, you&#8217;re right.  As an investor, that&#8217;s precisely when you do want the dividends, so you too can reinvest them cheaply.  As a laid-off commenter here ruefully pointed out, dollar cost averaging when you only get paid and receive dividends during the good times is a real screwjob.</p>
<p><i>Anyway, buying equity is definitely a gamble in this environment but with prices the way they are, you can come out way ahead if you pick winners.</i></p>
<p>Just be careful.  Every fundamental metric you&#8217;d use to value these securities must be treated as suspect in this environment, including dividend yield.  If the worst should happen, you absorb all losses first.</p>
<p>If you feel bullish, you might apply your instincts to buying junk bonds or convertibles instead.  They&#8217;re at record wides to Treasuries, and in the unlikely event of bankruptcy, you&#8217;re in a much better position.</p>
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		<title>By: spare some change?</title>
		<link>http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/11/kiss-those-dividends-goodbye.html#comment-27231</link>
		<dc:creator>spare some change?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 09:46:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Cutting dividends isn&#039;t necessarily a sign of weakness. During a credit crunch the last thing you want to be doing is paying out dividends to shareholders.  You want to conserve that cash for acquisitions.  The companies with cash will be the great whites in the sea of capitalism once their competitors are broke.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Anyway, buying equity is definitely a gamble in this environment but with prices the way they are, you can come out way ahead if you pick winners.  Everybody investing for the long haul understands this, but everyone also has a different concept of what a winner is, so the rally just around the corner will lift everything.  Don&#039;t drink the kool aid, focus on value for your investing dollars, and you&#039;ll get to share in the rewards.  Isn&#039;t that what capitalism is all about?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cutting dividends isn&#8217;t necessarily a sign of weakness. During a credit crunch the last thing you want to be doing is paying out dividends to shareholders.  You want to conserve that cash for acquisitions.  The companies with cash will be the great whites in the sea of capitalism once their competitors are broke.</p>
<p>Anyway, buying equity is definitely a gamble in this environment but with prices the way they are, you can come out way ahead if you pick winners.  Everybody investing for the long haul understands this, but everyone also has a different concept of what a winner is, so the rally just around the corner will lift everything.  Don&#8217;t drink the kool aid, focus on value for your investing dollars, and you&#8217;ll get to share in the rewards.  Isn&#8217;t that what capitalism is all about?</p>
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		<title>By: doc holiday</title>
		<link>http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/11/kiss-those-dividends-goodbye.html#comment-27228</link>
		<dc:creator>doc holiday</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 08:33:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/11/kiss-those-dividends-goodbye/#comment-27228</guid>
		<description>Dividends are universally dead meat!  IMHO, the reason stocks are still highly overvalued is because of dividends that are out of line with fundamental future valuation.  These days, I just look at the dividend as the percentage that the stock is over-valued.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;As I continue watching the yield curve fall apart, I question how long it will be, before the 10-year Treasury falls below 3%, thus when I see any corporation with a div yield near or above 3%, alarm bells go off&lt;br/&gt;A great recent example is a stock like Citi which has a crashing share price but a dividend that hangs in place, frozen and unchanging, as if Citi is a great future growth opportunity.  The juxtaposition and inequitable disparity of the crashing market value and the illogical off-set of offering dividend bait is absurd to a point where it’s false and misleading touting.  How can a company like C support and then sustain a dividend?  Citi has EPS of negative $4.09 per share and they have to beg taxpayers for cash to keep the doors open, but they have a div yield of 10.80%  --  wow, I’m impressed and I wonder how many people will get a piece of that going forward.  Going back to my theory, C, IMHO is overvalued by at least 11%.  Don&#039;t get me started on compensation and XMAS Bonus structures, or I&#039;ll never shut up...&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;The solution to this dividend problem can be easily found by going back and doing some DD on WaMu, Indymac and a long list of stocks that have decreased EPS, decreasing earnings yields (the inverse of the P/E) high share prices and high div yields  --  which obviously are related to Treasury yields at zero.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Furthermore, this overvaluation of these assets is directly related to the probability of deflation, thus in this story here, to read that, “ Stock dividends are disappearing at the fastest rate in 50 years as the worsening recession forces U.S. companies to conserve cash” is no shock to me at all.  The fact is, money is being destroyed and not replaced.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dividends are universally dead meat!  IMHO, the reason stocks are still highly overvalued is because of dividends that are out of line with fundamental future valuation.  These days, I just look at the dividend as the percentage that the stock is over-valued.</p>
<p>As I continue watching the yield curve fall apart, I question how long it will be, before the 10-year Treasury falls below 3%, thus when I see any corporation with a div yield near or above 3%, alarm bells go off<br />A great recent example is a stock like Citi which has a crashing share price but a dividend that hangs in place, frozen and unchanging, as if Citi is a great future growth opportunity.  The juxtaposition and inequitable disparity of the crashing market value and the illogical off-set of offering dividend bait is absurd to a point where it’s false and misleading touting.  How can a company like C support and then sustain a dividend?  Citi has EPS of negative $4.09 per share and they have to beg taxpayers for cash to keep the doors open, but they have a div yield of 10.80%  &#8212;  wow, I’m impressed and I wonder how many people will get a piece of that going forward.  Going back to my theory, C, IMHO is overvalued by at least 11%.  Don&#8217;t get me started on compensation and XMAS Bonus structures, or I&#8217;ll never shut up&#8230;</p>
<p>The solution to this dividend problem can be easily found by going back and doing some DD on WaMu, Indymac and a long list of stocks that have decreased EPS, decreasing earnings yields (the inverse of the P/E) high share prices and high div yields  &#8212;  which obviously are related to Treasury yields at zero.</p>
<p>Furthermore, this overvaluation of these assets is directly related to the probability of deflation, thus in this story here, to read that, “ Stock dividends are disappearing at the fastest rate in 50 years as the worsening recession forces U.S. companies to conserve cash” is no shock to me at all.  The fact is, money is being destroyed and not replaced.</p>
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