Comments on: Black Hole Alert: Fannie, Freddie Cash Needs May Exceed $200 Billion http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash.html Sun, 22 Nov 2009 01:53:05 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: Anonymous http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash.html#comment-36147 Anonymous Wed, 11 Feb 2009 11:23:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash-needs-may-exceed-200-billion/#comment-36147 It appears that Fannie and Freddie lost roughly 200billion in a quarter and you would have to ask whether this will continue until house prices stop falling early next year. While home owners are allowed to make up valuations for their houses to circumvent bank risk rules then these losses seem likely to continue. This bill comes on top of the fact that the treasury is having to buy the Fannie and Freddie debt because no international investors will touch it with a barge pole. Black hole is right and who cares about another couple of trillion of taxpayers money spent or printed. This is all about lowering payments for people who cannot pay due to risk assessment levels rising. Circumventing the rules just loads the taxpayer up with risk and just delays the deleveraging of personal debts which need to take place to meet realistic debt risk assessment. For those that loose their jobs or suffer a one of income impairment then mortgage holidays are an appropriate course of action, for those that are just out of their depth, then why should they be subsidized by everyone else. Sure prices will drop, but they will be on the rise again far sooner. It appears that Fannie and Freddie lost roughly 200billion in a quarter and you would have to ask whether this will continue until house prices stop falling early next year. While home owners are allowed to make up valuations for their houses to circumvent bank risk rules then these losses seem likely to continue. This bill comes on top of the fact that the treasury is having to buy the Fannie and Freddie debt because no international investors will touch it with a barge pole. Black hole is right and who cares about another couple of trillion of taxpayers money spent or printed. This is all about lowering payments for people who cannot pay due to risk assessment levels rising. Circumventing the rules just loads the taxpayer up with risk and just delays the deleveraging of personal debts which need to take place to meet realistic debt risk assessment. For those that loose their jobs or suffer a one of income impairment then mortgage holidays are an appropriate course of action, for those that are just out of their depth, then why should they be subsidized by everyone else. Sure prices will drop, but they will be on the rise again far sooner.

]]> By: Martin, the Netherlands http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash.html#comment-36138 Martin, the Netherlands Wed, 11 Feb 2009 09:10:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash-needs-may-exceed-200-billion/#comment-36138 Thank you for your replies. Thank you for your replies.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash.html#comment-36121 Anonymous Wed, 11 Feb 2009 06:37:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash-needs-may-exceed-200-billion/#comment-36121 Do you really want all the banks to become nationalized where the taxpayer has to pay the debt off that is 4X the world's GDP. <br/><br/>This is the dilemma. Do you really want all the banks to become nationalized where the taxpayer has to pay the debt off that is 4X the world’s GDP.

This is the dilemma.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash.html#comment-36055 Anonymous Wed, 11 Feb 2009 01:42:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash-needs-may-exceed-200-billion/#comment-36055 I want to short the entire World IB's and Uuberments that had a hand in this cow dung pile. Square one stuff. Let see how they transition to domestic duty's, lots of dirty feet out there need cleaning aka the tax payers. <br/><br/>Skippy I want to short the entire World IB’s and Uuberments that had a hand in this cow dung pile. Square one stuff. Let see how they transition to domestic duty’s, lots of dirty feet out there need cleaning aka the tax payers.

Skippy

]]> By: doc holiday http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash.html#comment-36049 doc holiday Wed, 11 Feb 2009 00:41:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash-needs-may-exceed-200-billion/#comment-36049 ruetheday,<br/><br/>It's been about a week or two, but last time I checked, the total combined market cap of Ford & GM was less that 50% of Avon Corporation -- and ah, yah, we need a few trillion to bail out the auto makers (along with worthless wall street banks) because they were all so well educated @ Harvard and so Friggn talented at burning cash and God forbid that any of these people involved in this shitpile be fired or placed in prison -- because they just have too much damn value and obviously add value to The American Dream and our GDP and all that other voodoo doll shit .... puke, puke... ahhhh ruetheday,

It's been about a week or two, but last time I checked, the total combined market cap of Ford & GM was less that 50% of Avon Corporation — and ah, yah, we need a few trillion to bail out the auto makers (along with worthless wall street banks) because they were all so well educated @ Harvard and so Friggn talented at burning cash and God forbid that any of these people involved in this shitpile be fired or placed in prison — because they just have too much damn value and obviously add value to The American Dream and our GDP and all that other voodoo doll shit …. puke, puke… ahhhh

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash.html#comment-36048 Anonymous Wed, 11 Feb 2009 00:35:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash-needs-may-exceed-200-billion/#comment-36048 CNBC? you mean the network that thru a ticker tape celebration when the DOW past 14,000 in 2007(big clue to pull out of the market at the time). The same network that never said a word about this until 2 years later? If I need to listen to them tell me why we are here now, I am in big trouble. No thaks. CNBC? you mean the network that thru a ticker tape celebration when the DOW past 14,000 in 2007(big clue to pull out of the market at the time). The same network that never said a word about this until 2 years later? If I need to listen to them tell me why we are here now, I am in big trouble. No thaks.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash.html#comment-36046 Anonymous Wed, 11 Feb 2009 00:07:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash-needs-may-exceed-200-billion/#comment-36046 CEO JOHN STUMPF SAYS TREASURY INVESTMENT OF TAXPAYER DOLLARS INTO BANK "A WISE AND PROFITABLE INVESTMENT" FOR COUNTRY AND ECONOMY<br/>http://www.iii.co.uk/news/?type=afxnews&articleid=7162037&action=article<br/><br/>Uh-Huh next<br/><br/>CEO LEWIS SAYS BANKS' ROLE IS TO HELP CREATORS OF ECONOMIC VALUE<br/>http://www.iii.co.uk/news/?type=afxnews&articleid=7162035&action=article<br/><br/>Short these clowns to ZERO. CEO JOHN STUMPF SAYS TREASURY INVESTMENT OF TAXPAYER DOLLARS INTO BANK "A WISE AND PROFITABLE INVESTMENT" FOR COUNTRY AND ECONOMY
http://www.iii.co.uk/news/?type=afxnews&articleid=7162037&action=article

Uh-Huh next

CEO LEWIS SAYS BANKS' ROLE IS TO HELP CREATORS OF ECONOMIC VALUE
http://www.iii.co.uk/news/?type=afxnews&articleid=7162035&action=article

Short these clowns to ZERO.

]]> By: ruetheday http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash.html#comment-36042 ruetheday Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:42:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash-needs-may-exceed-200-billion/#comment-36042 Market Capitalization<br/><br/>BAC - 27.9 billion<br/>Citi - 18.3 billion<br/>JPM - 91.9 billion<br/>WFC - 69.1 billion<br/><br/>Total Market Cap - $207.2 billion<br/><br/>Can someone tell me why we just announced we're going to spend:<br/><br/>$250-500 billion to acquire bad assets from these banks<br/>$1 TRILLION for the Fed to buy securitized assets<br/>$50 billion in mortgage mods for foreclosure prevention<br/>An undisclosed amount ($100 billion+ in direct capital injections)<br/><br/>Instead of just BUYING these 4 banks?<br/><br/>Morgan Stanley and Goldman, TOGETHER, have a market cap of $64 billion.<br/><br/>Fannie and Freddie (of which the gov't already owns 79.9%) have market caps in the hundreds of millions only.<br/><br/>Across the board, bank market caps are in the dump. <br/><br/>The government could simply buy all the problem banks for a fraction of what they're spending on asset purchases/insurance/other nonsense. Market Capitalization

BAC – 27.9 billion
Citi – 18.3 billion
JPM – 91.9 billion
WFC – 69.1 billion

Total Market Cap – $207.2 billion

Can someone tell me why we just announced we’re going to spend:

$250-500 billion to acquire bad assets from these banks
$1 TRILLION for the Fed to buy securitized assets
$50 billion in mortgage mods for foreclosure prevention
An undisclosed amount ($100 billion+ in direct capital injections)

Instead of just BUYING these 4 banks?

Morgan Stanley and Goldman, TOGETHER, have a market cap of $64 billion.

Fannie and Freddie (of which the gov’t already owns 79.9%) have market caps in the hundreds of millions only.

Across the board, bank market caps are in the dump.

The government could simply buy all the problem banks for a fraction of what they’re spending on asset purchases/insurance/other nonsense.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash.html#comment-36040 Anonymous Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:19:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash-needs-may-exceed-200-billion/#comment-36040 Freddie's Dead - that's pretty good<br/><br/><br/>... and if you don't mind<br/><br/>The Weight - by The Band<br/><br/><br/>Take a load off Fannie <br/>Take a load for free<br/>Take a load off Fannie<br/>And you put the load right on me Freddie’s Dead – that’s pretty good

… and if you don’t mind

The Weight – by The Band

Take a load off Fannie
Take a load for free
Take a load off Fannie
And you put the load right on me

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash.html#comment-36032 Anonymous Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:29:00 +0000 http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2009/02/black-hole-alert-fannie-freddie-cash-needs-may-exceed-200-billion/#comment-36032 Freddie's Dead<br/><br/>Everybody's misused him,<br/>Ripped him up and abused him,<br/>Another junkie plan,<br/>Pushin dope for the man.<br/><br/>Freddie's on the corner now.<br/><br/>Oh Where is Our Superfly? Freddie’s Dead

Everybody’s misused him,
Ripped him up and abused him,
Another junkie plan,
Pushin dope for the man.

Freddie’s on the corner now.

Oh Where is Our Superfly?

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