US Bank backed Mubarack is gone, and as Hedges predicts:
“any attempt to close the system further—say a replacement of Mubarak with another military dictator—will ensure a deeper radicalization in Egypt and the wider Arab world.”
Conscience of a Conservative
This is just a scary situation. Egypt is the linch-pin of American Middle East foreign policy, they receive billions in aid, have access to the best American Weapony. Then you have the Egypitan middle class who is worried about a break-down of rule of law, lawlessness and the rise of the Moslem brotherhood is the best organized party in all of Egypt.
Well, the religious authorities denounced this march, and it went ahead anyhow. Back in January, I remember counting the beards in the Tahrir Square crowd as a rough proxy for Muslim Brotherhood membership, and it was 25%, the same as the general population. So while they’re a player, I don’t think they’re the dominant player. However, the more the military prevent an actually functioning civil society from emerging, the more that the Muslim Brotherhood are likely to be the only ones standing when the regime does collapse. Perhaps that’s what they want. As always, the question of our elites is stupid and/or evil….
As for democracy, I think it’s more our place to be taught by the Egyptians, rather than to teach them. And it’s also so visible in the crowds what a really serious, maturely thought-through success can do for a people. That’s why I used the tag “We know the way to Tahrir Square.”
And as for fear, I’m a good deal more afraid of the Syrian situation, where the administration seems to be fomenting a war on Iran’s flank. I mean, at least the Bush administration had the common human decency to fake stories about baby killers in Saddam’s hospitals, but the administration is generating bloody and horrible footage for the same realpolitik. Not that I’m bitter or cynical.
Conscience of a Conservative
Unfortunately in Egypt, we know what our worst case is, it’s 1970’s Iran after the Shah. The United States is hoping that it can control the situation by using influence with the Egyptian military, but the arrests and trials regarding non-profits these last few days, throws that influence in doubt.
Middle Seaman
For all the bad mouthing: Egypt is a very poor country. It’s also a very populated country, about 100m people. It’s the duty, responsibility and the right political move to support them financially and otherwise.
The Egyptian Spring was a miracle that will lead and shine for a long time to come. It is a now a military led country and the Muslim Brotherhood will not change that much.
It is important to continue the support to Egypt and do as much as morally possible to stir them towards democracy and away from the pre-Sadat times when instead of food the government fed war to the masses.
Bored
Independence is the greateast threat, not radical Islam. As for political moves, perhaps saying nothing would have been better. The first meaningless words out of Ofraud’s mouth last year was’orderly transition. Here’s what he said:
“I don’t like to use labels for folks. Mubarak is a good man. He has done good things. He has maintained stability. We will continue to support him. He is a friend.”
Kind words for one of the most awful, brutal dictators anywhere. Follow the tentacles.
tom allen
“Follow the tentacles.” To the Daily Cthulhu, by any chance? :-P
stock
I created a nuclear information resource.
Point it out to anyone who is on the fence in terms of being pro or anti nuke.
There is quite a bit of original material, and just an overall good compilation of material, pointing out the big problems and the big lies of nuke.
I find it interesting how the Western World is callling for more Democracy in the Middle East and North Africa while supressing Demoracy where it was born(Athens) Greece. There’s talk of having Europe collect taxes for the Greeks, and many of the decisions on Greece’s citizens are being imposed on it by technocrats and members of the E.U.
Actually when the US/West/Israel (the real axis of evil) say “democracy” in the middle eastern context, it means replacing a “rogue” dictator by a friendly one. You won’t hear about “democracy promotion” with regard to the monarchies like Saudi, Jordan, Qatar etc because already they are friendly to US (and hence Israel).
“There’s also—the Egyptian opinion, public opinion, like throughout the Arab world, regards the United States and Israel as the major threats they face. In [Egypt], latest polls, about 90 percent. And they don’t regard Iran as a threat. Maybe 10 percent in the Arab world, major polls about a year ago, regard Iran as a threat. In fact, opposition to U.S. policy is so strong that throughout the Arab world, a majority—in Egypt, it’s 80 percent—think the region would be more secure if Iran had nuclear weapons. Well, you know, that’s not the kind of policy that the United States and Israel want to see implemented, needless to say, hence a strong opposition to the rise of any meaningful democracy.”
G3
Greece is the trailer for the austerity horror show coming to the Western world. If the conservative Trojan Horse (Ah Greece again) Obomba wins second term, he will gleefully go ahead and cut SS, Medicare etc.
And hey, Greece loves the Amreekan way of life – being run by “Government Sachs”, as Prof.Bill Black says.
Skippy
Egypt was fine till the canal, English and ottomans.
US Bank backed Mubarack is gone, and as Hedges predicts:
“any attempt to close the system further—say a replacement of Mubarak with another military dictator—will ensure a deeper radicalization in Egypt and the wider Arab world.”
This is just a scary situation. Egypt is the linch-pin of American Middle East foreign policy, they receive billions in aid, have access to the best American Weapony. Then you have the Egypitan middle class who is worried about a break-down of rule of law, lawlessness and the rise of the Moslem brotherhood is the best organized party in all of Egypt.
Well, the religious authorities denounced this march, and it went ahead anyhow. Back in January, I remember counting the beards in the Tahrir Square crowd as a rough proxy for Muslim Brotherhood membership, and it was 25%, the same as the general population. So while they’re a player, I don’t think they’re the dominant player. However, the more the military prevent an actually functioning civil society from emerging, the more that the Muslim Brotherhood are likely to be the only ones standing when the regime does collapse. Perhaps that’s what they want. As always, the question of our elites is stupid and/or evil….
As for democracy, I think it’s more our place to be taught by the Egyptians, rather than to teach them. And it’s also so visible in the crowds what a really serious, maturely thought-through success can do for a people. That’s why I used the tag “We know the way to Tahrir Square.”
And as for fear, I’m a good deal more afraid of the Syrian situation, where the administration seems to be fomenting a war on Iran’s flank. I mean, at least the Bush administration had the common human decency to fake stories about baby killers in Saddam’s hospitals, but the administration is generating bloody and horrible footage for the same realpolitik. Not that I’m bitter or cynical.
Unfortunately in Egypt, we know what our worst case is, it’s 1970’s Iran after the Shah. The United States is hoping that it can control the situation by using influence with the Egyptian military, but the arrests and trials regarding non-profits these last few days, throws that influence in doubt.
For all the bad mouthing: Egypt is a very poor country. It’s also a very populated country, about 100m people. It’s the duty, responsibility and the right political move to support them financially and otherwise.
The Egyptian Spring was a miracle that will lead and shine for a long time to come. It is a now a military led country and the Muslim Brotherhood will not change that much.
It is important to continue the support to Egypt and do as much as morally possible to stir them towards democracy and away from the pre-Sadat times when instead of food the government fed war to the masses.
Independence is the greateast threat, not radical Islam. As for political moves, perhaps saying nothing would have been better. The first meaningless words out of Ofraud’s mouth last year was’orderly transition. Here’s what he said:
“I don’t like to use labels for folks. Mubarak is a good man. He has done good things. He has maintained stability. We will continue to support him. He is a friend.”
Kind words for one of the most awful, brutal dictators anywhere. Follow the tentacles.
“Follow the tentacles.” To the Daily Cthulhu, by any chance? :-P
I created a nuclear information resource.
Point it out to anyone who is on the fence in terms of being pro or anti nuke.
There is quite a bit of original material, and just an overall good compilation of material, pointing out the big problems and the big lies of nuke.
Drop a comment
http://nukepimp.blogspot.com/
I find it interesting how the Western World is callling for more Democracy in the Middle East and North Africa while supressing Demoracy where it was born(Athens) Greece. There’s talk of having Europe collect taxes for the Greeks, and many of the decisions on Greece’s citizens are being imposed on it by technocrats and members of the E.U.
Talking about Greek Democracy and/or General Strike
He is the outcome of today’s events:
‘Austerity bill approved as Athens burns’ (literally)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eS6BijNMsPY
Meanwhile a Columnist in one of the main Irish Newspaper ends today’s column with
“It’s at this point that the Bastille is stormed”
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/analysis/carol-hunt-well-only-be-pushed-so-far-enda-theres-nothing-left-to-take-from-us-3016993.html
Actually when the US/West/Israel (the real axis of evil) say “democracy” in the middle eastern context, it means replacing a “rogue” dictator by a friendly one. You won’t hear about “democracy promotion” with regard to the monarchies like Saudi, Jordan, Qatar etc because already they are friendly to US (and hence Israel).
http://www.democracynow.org/2011/9/19/noam_chomsky_the_us_israel_strongly
“There’s also—the Egyptian opinion, public opinion, like throughout the Arab world, regards the United States and Israel as the major threats they face. In [Egypt], latest polls, about 90 percent. And they don’t regard Iran as a threat. Maybe 10 percent in the Arab world, major polls about a year ago, regard Iran as a threat. In fact, opposition to U.S. policy is so strong that throughout the Arab world, a majority—in Egypt, it’s 80 percent—think the region would be more secure if Iran had nuclear weapons. Well, you know, that’s not the kind of policy that the United States and Israel want to see implemented, needless to say, hence a strong opposition to the rise of any meaningful democracy.”
Greece is the trailer for the austerity horror show coming to the Western world. If the conservative Trojan Horse (Ah Greece again) Obomba wins second term, he will gleefully go ahead and cut SS, Medicare etc.
And hey, Greece loves the Amreekan way of life – being run by “Government Sachs”, as Prof.Bill Black says.
Egypt was fine till the canal, English and ottomans.
Skippy… Bonds… again!