9/11 Commissioner and Co-Chair of Congressional Inquiry into 9/11 Say in Sworn Declarations that Saudi Government Linked to 9/11 Attacks

By Washington’s Blog

Two Senators with Access to Classified Information Say Saudi Government Backed 9/11 Attack

Two former senators – one a 9/11 Commissioner, the other the co-chair of the joint Congressional inquiry into 9/11 – state in sworn declarations that the Saudi government backed the 9/11 attack.

The New York Times reports:

For more than a decade, questions have lingered about the possible role of the Saudi government in the attacks on Sept. 11, 2001, even as the royal kingdom has made itself a crucial counterterrorism partner in the eyes of American diplomats.

Now, in sworn statements that seem likely to reignite the debate, two former senators who were privy to top secret information on the Saudis’ activities say they believe that the Saudi government might have played a direct role in the terrorist attacks.

“I am convinced that there was a direct line between at least some of the terrorists who carried out the September 11th attacks and the government of Saudi Arabia,” former Senator Bob Graham, Democrat of Florida, said in an affidavit filed as part of a lawsuit brought against the Saudi government and dozens of institutions in the country by families of Sept. 11 victims and others. Mr. Graham led a joint 2002 Congressional inquiry into the attacks.

As we noted last year:

The Co-Chair of the Congressional Inquiry into 9/11 and former Head of the Senate Intelligence Committee, Bob Graham, previously stated that an FBI informant had hosted and rented a room to two hijackers in 2000 and that, when the Inquiry sought to interview the informant, the FBI refused outright, and then hid him in an unknown location, and that a high-level FBI official stated these blocking maneuvers were undertaken under orders from the White House (confirmed here).

Today, Graham called for a new 9/11 investigation. As Raw Story notes:

Graham on Monday called on the U.S. government to reopen its investigation into 9/11 after a report found that links between Saudi Arabia and the hijackers were never disclosed by the FBI to the 2002 joint Congressional intelligence committee investigating the attacks.

“In the final report of the congressional inquiry, there was a chapter related primarily to the Saudi role in 9/11 that was totally censored, every word of the chapter has been withheld from the public,” Graham said on MSNBC’s The Dylan Ratigan Show.

“Some of the other questions we ought to be asking are if we know that the Saudis who lived in San Diego and now apparently in Sarasota received substantial assistance, what about the Saudis who lived in Phoenix, Arizona? Or Arlington, Virginia? … What was happening in those places?”

“I believe these are questions for which there are definitive answers, but the American people and largely their elected representatives have been denied that information.”

The Times continues:

His former Senate colleague, Bob Kerrey of Nebraska, a Democrat who served on the separate 9/11 Commission, said in a sworn affidavit of his own in the case that “significant questions remain unanswered” about the role of Saudi institutions. “Evidence relating to the plausible involvement of possible Saudi government agents in the September 11th attacks has never been fully pursued,” Mr. Kerrey said.

Their affidavits, which were filed on Friday and have not previously been disclosed, are part of a multibillion-dollar lawsuit that has wound its way through federal courts since 2002. An appellate court, reversing an earlier decision, said in November that foreign nations were not immune to lawsuits under certain terrorism claims, clearing the way for parts of the Saudi case to be reheard in United States District Court in Manhattan.


The Saudis are seeking to have the case dismissed in part because they say American inquiries — including those in which Mr. Graham and Mr. Kerrey took part — have essentially exonerated them. A recent court filing by the Saudis prominently cited the 9/11 Commission’s “exhaustive” final report, which “found no evidence that the Saudi government as an institution or senior Saudi individuals funded” Al Qaeda.

But Mr. Kerrey and Mr. Graham said that the findings should not be seen as an exoneration and that many important questions about the Saudis’ role had never been fully examined, partly because their panels simply did not have the time or resources given their wider scope.

Terry Strada of New Vernon, N.J., whose husband died in the World Trade Center, said it was “so absurd that it’s laughable” for the Saudis to claim that the federal inquiries had exonerated them.

Unanswered questions include the work of a number of Saudi-sponsored charities with financial links to Al Qaeda, as well as the role of a Saudi citizen living in San Diego at the time of the attacks, Omar al-Bayoumi, who had ties to two of the hijackers and to Saudi officials, Mr. Graham said in his affidavit.

Still, Washington has continued to stand behind Saudi Arabia publicly, with the Justice Department joining the kingdom in trying to have the lawsuits thrown out of court on the grounds that the Saudis are protected by international immunity.

As we’ve repeatedly noted:

9/11 Commissioner Bob Kerrey said that “There are ample reasons to suspect that there may be some alternative to what we outlined in our version . . . We didn’t have access . . . .” He also says that it might take “a permanent 9/11 commission” to end the remaining mysteries of September 11

Indeed, while everyone remembers the false allegations about Iraqi weapons of mass destruction, most forget that the other primary justification for the war was the false linkage between Iraq and 9/11.

The failure to really investigate 9/11 led us into a disastrous war … which has virtually bankrupted our country.

Unfortunately, the endless wars in the Middle East and North Africa are about oil, not national security (and see this).

So we have idiots like MSNBC talking head Joe Scarborough saying that – even if the Saudi government backed the 9/11 attacks – Saudi oil is too important to do anything about it:

Print Friendly, PDF & Email


  1. Dirk

    “The enemy of my enemy is my friend”

    Especially when you can hoodwink the enemy of your enemy into wasting his treasure and blood to fight your enemy.

    1. pdx

      I’ve never been very interested in exactly how/why the Twin Towers came down, but I always thought it was pretty obvious that the Saudis badgered/flattered Dubya into attacking Iran for them. We’re their mercenaries, you see.

      1. LeonovaBalletRusse

        pdx, a shameful admission. Why have you not been interested in why the Twin Towers came down? Are you stoned, brain dead, a tool of the Global Reich?

        1. sgt_doom

          The principal reason one shouldn’t spend too much valuable time on the destruction of those towers is that any fundamental research into the backgrounds of the passengers aboard those four aircraft that day is explanation enough.

          In any standard homicide investigation, the investigator routinely looks into the background of the victim(s), as in the majority of the cases, the murderer knew their victim(s) (the exception being the random killing or robbery-homicide).

          The crucial aspect is to always follow the money and the obvious facts: prior the investigation into the BCCI, during the Bush #1 (G.H.W. Bush) administration, Robert Mueller III was appointed to head the criminal division of the Dept. of Justice, leading the BCCI probe away from the Bush White House.

          Four days prior to 9/11/01, Robert Mueller III was once again appointed by a Bush, this time Bush #2 (G. W. Bush) to be director of the FBI.

          One day prior to 9/11/01, the Pentagon’s comptroller announces that $2.3 trillion is unaccounted for.

          Seven hours prior to 9:00 AM, 9/11/01, an departmental e-mail goes out to all members of (both onsite and offsite) of the DIA’s Financial Management Group to attend an emergency meeting that morning (their offices being by the Pentagon’s West Wall).

          On 9/11/01, nearly the entire Financial Management Group of the DIA is either severely injured or killed by a plane flying into the Pentagon’s west wall — along with the destruction of computer systems involved in that $2.3 trillion variance.

          Only the facts….

          1. Lambert Strether

            On the one hand, for years I’ve been running The Department of “No, They Would Never Do That!” And of course, they always do.

            On the other hand, I suspect that the world of real conspiracies (assuming that not to be a redundant phrase) is a lot less like a game of pool (or billiards, or snooker) than presented here. There’s a lot more fog, chaos, randomness, and ordinary human #FAIL (and goodness and heroism too, of course). There’s more friction. “Get the ball in the pocket, never mind getting dandelions pulled or the screen door patched. or the beef steak pounded….”

          2. LeonovaBalletRusse

            sgt_doom, Mueller a very dark character, and a name known in the Nazi Party. But how do you connect him with FBI’s “bad boy” John O’Neill, who “disappeared” in one of the Twin Towers on 911. They hated O’Neill, as he was closing in on Osama and 911 to come. They defeated his goals systematically, until they got rid of him entirely.

            It’s in YouTube videos anent John O’Neill that you see the lies of fear or complicity in the eyes of General Clarke.

      2. Dave of Maryland

        the Saudis badgered/flattered Dubya into attacking Iran

        W never attacked Iran. Hello to our old Q and N confusion.

        Over at Winter Patriot is the proof: http://winterpatriot.blogspot.com/2011/09/ten-years-of-murderous-nonsense.html

        When the smoke and dust cleared, we could clearly see a few of the tridents from WTC 1 & 2 still standing. These were part of the atrium, which I and many others will well-remember. The mass of the towers falling on top of them would have left a 200 foot high pile of debris, burying tridents and everything else. Instead, as WP points out, there was next to no debris.

        Welcome to the results of Star Wars. Does Saudi Arabia have star wars technology?

        1. Walter Wit Man

          The lack of building materials may explain some of this. Hundreds of tons of concrete were probably not poured as planned. See the discussion below about the towers being “hollow.”

          1. Yves Smith

            I’m happy to have people debunk, but you need to do better than this.

            This was a steel framed building, and the core was not made of concrete either.

          2. sgt_doom

            “And who was on those planes you say?”

            From the link below:


            When the BCCI investigation reached closer to President Geo. H.W. Bush’s White House back in the late ’80s, early ’90s, Bush appointed Robert Mueller III to be the chief of the DOJ’s Criminal Division to manage the BCCI probe — or more accurately, to deflect it away from the Bush administration and narrow the scope of the investigation.

            Four days prior to 9/11/01, President Geo. W. Bush appoints Robert Mueller III to be director of the FBI — perfect timing and what a pedigree Mueller possesses.*

            One day prior to 9/11/01, the Pentagon’s comptroller announces that $2.3 trillion cannot be accounted for.**

            Six to seven hours prior to the events of that 9/11 morning, sometime between 2:00 AM and 3:00 AM (EST) a group email is transmitted to the DIA’s financial management staff to attend an emergency meeting that very morning at their Pentagon offices — located at the Pentagon’s west wall. One staff member will fortuitously oversleep, viewing the email late and consequently arrive late — just in time to view from afar the plane crashing into the super-reinforced west wall, severely injuring or killing almost the entire financial management group of the DIA, and those computer systems involved with discovering said missing funds; apparently data backups aren’t the order of the day?

            That very same morning on 9/11/01, the National Reconnaissance Office’s (NRO) ops center would be evacuated due to an exercise simulating an attack by suicide aircraft flying into that facility. (Sound vaguely familiar?) Therefore, no one was on hand to manually task their recon satellites on the airspace above NYC and the Pentagon.

            Thanks to further expansion of the Web over the Internet (2003 – 2005), cached pages of dramatically increased data transmission and EFTs, originating from three firms residing in the two WTC towers to offshore locations, could be accessed.

            Shortly after 9/2001, in early 2002, an explosive growth occurs in offshore hedge funds.

            Background research on those unfortunate passengers aboard the involved airliners (victims who were certain to die that day) indicated that some of the pax fall into three unique groups, along with three unique individuals aboard.

            The three groups: (1) developers of remote piloting hardware and software; (2) individuals involved in the creation of a terrorist scenario remarkably similar to that which occurred on 9/11/01 (among that group of victims was an Israeli counterterrorist expert and one of the airliners’ pilots, a former career Naval officer); and, (3) some of the individuals involved with the investigation into Flight 800’s demise.

            The three individuals: (1) wife number three of the solicitor general, who would quickly move on to wife number four once the insurance settlement came through (death by opportunity?); (2) a lady attorney, rumored to be involved with a senior married partner of the conservative and politically-connected law firm which successfully defended Fox News on several cases of fictionalizing the news (death by opportunity?); and, (3) a physicist with the Naval Surface Warfare Center’s Directed Energy Section.

            [We are not suggesting any of these victims were aware of the events to transpire on 9/11 — this appears to be a highly compartmentalized operation.]

            Intensive pattern analysis, link analysis, and link and group analysis indicates the five principal players involved: the Blackstone Group, Veritas Capital, AIG, the office of the VP, and the office of the SecDef.

            Some time prior to 9/11/01, a financial news announcement would explain an investment by AIG in the Blackstone Group (source document of transaction, along with hard copy source documents of thousands of ongoing SEC investigations resided in the destroyed WTC Building 7 – no source docs, case closed!). The amount of AIG’s investment was approximately the final insurance payout amount to the property management/RE firm for the WTC destruction (classic paper money false transfer and money laundering scheme, relatively simple — for a far more circuitous, and commonplace, accounting scheme, please see Retirement Heist, by Ellen Schultz, p. 209 on “leveraged ESOPs”).

            The mortgage owner of record for WTC Building 7: the Blackstone Group.

            The firm awarded the $1 billion captive insurance fund management contract by Bush’s FEMA, for settlement with WTC victims’ families: the Blackstone Group.

            The firm which negotiated the largest and quickest real estate deal in NYC history, the WTC lease transfer from the Port Authority of NY and NJ to Silverstein Properties and Westfield America, Inc.: the Blackstone Group.

            During the week prior to 9/11/01, the fiber optic installation firm, EurekaGGN, installed dark fiber in the top floors of the two WTC towers (they had the contract for cabling the entire WTC), utilizing a method to pump the fiber optical cables through existing HVAC vents running beneath each floor.

            [To reiterate: the west wall of the Pentagon had been reinforced, according to Structure Magazine, which also posed the question as to why only one wall and a plane crashes into it. Fiber optic is being installed, but never verified as to being operational, in the WTC towers, and planes crash into them — access, access, access!]

            Technical details not widely known: two of the four airliners involved didn’t appear on the FAA Flight Registry which logs all commercial flights, per standard procedure, as they were reserved as DoD Special Charters, meaning that each plane must seat those reserved for DoD personnel, and must depart at the schedule time, but any remaining seats may be filled commercially.

            Aircraft pointedly flew to shadow zones – where radar coverage was obscured due to topography and ATCC limitations – where the transponders were then powered down – normally, they would have triggered ATCC radar indicators. (Highly doubtful those Saudi Arabian hijacker cutouts would have known these recondite details?); and recovered black box data, obtained through FOIA requests, give no indication of any hijacking taking place (and yes, there does exist a governmental database of black box hijacking data for comparison purposes).

            There were over 1,000 other “coincidences” which took place that morning, all tracking back to the five principal players.

            Recap: $2.3 trillion announced unaccounted, and DIA’s financial management group is almost entirely wiped out, along with involved computer systems, dramatically increased data transmissions and EFTs out of WTC towers in preceding 12 hours, and people and computer systems involved are killed and destroyed, with explosive growth in offshore hedge funds occurring shortly thereafter.

            Veritas Capital, owner of Raytheon subsidiary which employed those remote piloting hardware and software developers and subcontractors aboard some of those airliners involved in 9/11, and Veritas Capital makes some incredibly prescient defense industry investments shortly prior to 9/11/01.

            Increasing the awareness of evil….

            *Robert Mueller III, FBI director, is the grandnephew of Richard Bissell, one of the three top CIA types who President Kennedy fired. Mueller’s wife is the granddaughter of Charles Cabell, another of those three CIA people JFK had fired (the third was Allen Dulles, who would later manage the Warren Commission!

            **From 1988, to 2001, there was another several trillions missing from all government agencies total (so approximately $4 trillion went missing).

          3. Walter Wit Man


            You may be misinterpreting why I’m pointing to the lack of concrete in the buildings (hundreds of tons were not poured). The reason for the lack of debris at the demolition site could just as likely be because there was little concrete in the rubble rather than star wars technology (like a small nuclear bomb, etc.).

            It’s confusing because the perps had the building “vaporize” under their cover story. So supposedly all that concrete got turned into a dust and that’s why we don’t a bigger rubble pile.

            sgt doom,

            Yes! Good information. That’s interesting about the firms involved in the trading, etc.

            Did you see my link below that discussed the trading in part, but also mentioned the much bigger motive of clearing the hundreds of billions in black op bonds from Project Hammer (and actually from the days of the Black Eagle Trust)? That has a lot of interesting information. The financial motive for 9/11 is huge.

            There was the over $2 Trillion missing announced 9/10/01 but then we had Trillions more go missing over the subsequent 10 years. Didn’t we just have news on this? Plus, think how many more war and police expenditures the perps probably benefited from.

            It’s huge. And one can see how it would be worth it to really plan for one big operation that would serve a lot of different goals.

            So this also answers Lambert’s request below but first starting on the opposite side of the ledger. The profit motive. F’in HUUUUGE.

            So even spending $100 million or so on the operation would be cheap.

        2. PAUL TIOXON

          Gail Talese wrote a book about the building of the Verrazano-Narrows Bridge. After the fall of the Twin Towers, he wrote a follow up piece on the men who were involved in the construction of the WTC, as well as the bridge and many other buildings that went up during the 50s-70s. Big hulking Bethlehem Steel alloy girders went into almost everything in the NYC skyline. But for the first time, a new major project veered from the blast furnaces of Pennsylvania. The WTC was made from imported steel, slender girders that made up a new engineering structure of the WTC. The words of the iron worker showed a perspective from the people who did the assembly and saw a shift from the older massive over-engineered type of construction for the ages replaced by a Rockefeller driven mega-project built on land reclaimed from the river. They saw foreign steel replace domestic steel. They saw the first rotten shoots of the weed of global capitalism making a beachhead in lower Manhattan. What will the 1776 foot tall replacement reveal in its composition?


    2. Dirk

      Surprised that no one has mentioned that in spite of
      *ALL* non military air traffic being instantly grounded in the U.S., the Saudi Royals were allowed to fly out of the
      country in their private jet.

        1. Dave of Maryland

          Of having been made an unwitting scapegoat of US domestic policy. Saudis were got out of the country to spare them being lynched by pre-Tea Partiers.

        2. Jill


          Here’s my speculation. The US govt. had prior knowledge of the attacks and let them go down. I think there are many facts to back this assertion. That means they knew who was doing what and that people from S.A. were implicated.

          The US govt. further had every intention of using this attack as a pretext for war. Heretofore, the US govt. approached terrorist attacks as the criminal matter they were. They used law enforcement and they got convictions. With 9/11, the govt. had two problems arising from a legal response to these attacks: 1. trials risk leading to disclosure of facts and 2. it takes away the pretext for war.

          As this govt. clearly wanted a war to take over and Christianize Iraq (as Paul Wolfowitless said), get some oil, etc.– if the govt. is hyping war on anyone involved in 9/11 wouldn’t they have to go to war with S.A.? But S.A. is our BFF and friends don’t let friends be regime changed! Without a trial, discovery of actual information is quashed, the drums of war get beaten towards the former BFF and do not get beaten towards S.A.

          1. Walter Wit Man

            Richard Clarke backs up your supposition that the U.S. allowed it to happen: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRmWFnnIb8g

            Of course I think this is a cover story intended to pin the blame on the Saudis and claim the U.S. allowed it to happen out of negligence rather than a more devious plan (they were trying to get a agent inside Al Qaeda).

          2. JamesW

            Please, enough with the speculation, please stick to the facts instead of trying to make everything so ideologically nonsensical — ideology is for fools. Period!

            Economics does not follow ideology, no matter how many times those super-highly-paid TV morons claim it to be so!

            There’s always some witless fools out there who believe it is all and always about ideology!

            Follow the money…cui bono…

            Fact: The three principal organizations who profited mightily and were involved in major ways were: (1) Blackstone Group, (2) Veritas Capital and (3) A.I.G., while the #4 and #5 parties were obviously the Office of the V.P. (Cheney) and Office of the SecDef (Rumsfeld).

            Fact: (1) Blackstone Group brokered the quickest and largest deal in NYC real estate history: the transfer of the lease of WTC from the Port Authority of NY and NJ to Silverstein Properties and Westfield America, Inc. Blackstone Group was also mortgage holder of record on WTC Building Seven, and Blackstone was awarded the captive insurance fund ($1 billion from Bush’s FEMA) which they strucuted like a private equity fund (profiting from it) to dole out the money to the families of those WTC victims.
            (2) Veritas Capital, shortly prior to 9/11/01, began a strategic investment program in all things defense-related — quite prescient. Veritas had purchased Raytheon Aviation sometime earlier from Taytheon, and one of the three unique groups aboard that day were affiliated with that subsidiary (and also subcontractors) who were involved in remote piloting hardware and software development. Veritas would later own DynCorp, and by default DynPort Vaccine Company, which was physically situated nearby Ft. Detrick, Md., and had the requisite lab equipment to weaponize the Anthrax used after 9/11, which probably originated at Detrick (which did not have the necessary ovens to weaponize the Anthrax).
            (3) A.I.G.’s subsidiary was Marsh & McLennan, and AIG had made an investment in Blackstone Group some months earlier (typical false paper money transfer???) which would be the same exact amount as their insurance payout to Silverstein, plus AIG at that time owned the subsidiary which was either the number one or number two commercial jet leasing firm in existence. (And the senior principal at Marsh was one Stephen Friedman, Goldman Sachs, and occupied a set on every intelligence panel and committee over the past 20 years, including the Jeremiah Panel, the intel panel strategizing on the future of the National Reconnaissance Office (which, BTW, that morning had been evacuated during a simulated drill of experiencing aircraft flying into their facility and ops center — thereby they couldn’t task any recon satellites on the airspace above either NYC nor the Pentagon during that timeframe.)

            Two of the four commercial aircraft never appeared, as per SOP, on the FAA Flight Registry, where all commercial flights normally appear — because they were DoD Special Charter, meaning they had to honor DoD reservations, and take off at the scheduled time, but were allowed to fill any and all empty seats with normal commercial passengers.

            One could go on, but hopefully you beginning to get the message, finally, as in follow the money — how did they transmit those trillions ($2.3 missing from the Pentagon and probably another trillion or two missing from any number of government agencies)? Cantor Fitzgerald’s TradeSpark operation, Marsh & McLennan and Deutsche Bank’s comm center showed dramatically increased data communications and EFTs in the twelve hourse preceding 9:00AM on 9/11/01, per cached pages which could only be accessed when the ‘net reached critical mass around 2003-2004.

            And what outfits were destroyed by the two aircraft crashing into the towers?


            (And to the comment following on Richard Clarke, Clarke is an utter stooge, please never, ever believe anything he claims! He’s only there for redirection and misdirection!)

          3. Walter Wit Man

            Great post JamesW. Good information.

            I speculate about similar financial motives below and after reading your comment I am reminded about the apparent insider trading that occurred before 9/11.

            Some reports put it in the trillions of dollars.

            See here http://anationbeguiled.wordpress.com/2011/11/05/bush%E2%80%99s-project-hammer-and-the-911-deception/ for the explosive allegation that 9/11 was a way to basically clear black op bonds dating from the days of Project Hammer.

            Actually, I had forgotten about this article and it’s a must read! I still haven’t grappled with all of it.

          4. LeonovaBalletRusse

            JamesW, great post. It’s always about the money, and no military stooge pitching red herrings is to be trusted.

    1. LeonovaBalletRusse

      CF, see: “HOUSE OF BUSH/HOUSE OF SAUD” — the Bush Dynasty are guilty of Treason: serving a Foreign Power while in elected Office. Follow the jet planes filled with Saudis jetting to Saudi Arabia immediately after 911, when all other flights were grounded by order of the President/Commander in Chief.

      BUST them.

      1. just me

        Yeah, but how do you know they’re not the airbag to protect the next deeper level, like good old hollow MERS? The more I watch the design of these scams, the more it seems like matruschka dolls of airbags. There’s always a deeper layer protected by a bang above. In fact I wonder if the layer below doesn’t blow up the layer above. Exploding bolts on escape hatches, something.

        1. JamesW

          Exactly and thanks!

          Sure there was Saudi involvement, with those hijackers being the cutouts, standard operating procedure in intel ops.

          They may very well have all believed it was about terrorism, and the history’s largest heist.

          Remember, in early 2002, hedge fund size and activity inexplicably exploded!

          1. LeonovaBalletRusse

            JamesW, don’t forget about the short and long positions taken by insiders before 911, which the German firm was able to recover some information about from a “ruined” hard disc after the fact.

            Also, why was the metal shipped IMMEDIATELY to China, and where did the gold bullion go? Don’t you know that Giuliani had many more insiders than Kerick to help him get rid of whatever evidence was left. What was his payday?

      2. LucyLulu

        Perhaps the timing of the departure of the Saudi Royals bears significance however the lockdown on US airspace was not as complete as reported. I was teaching at the time and had a student who came to me to explain why he had been absent from class the two days immediately following 9/11. His family owned a limousine service and he had been enlisted to discreetly drive around royal figures from Dubai who were in town for the Sept. Thoroughbred sales (and own an over-the-top horse farm) in order to ensure their safety until their plane (personal 747, common fixture at Bluegrass Airfield) got permission to leave. He was back in class because their flight had departed. US Airspace was still officially quite closed, and the departure was not made public knowledge. Kids find me difficult to con, and I didn’t take attendance so no excuse for his absences was needed. Furthermore, I knew him to be a conscientious, hard-working, honest kid (exception rather than rule). I mean, he was actually apologizing for missing class, which for those who have taught college know is a rarity. My point is that his story was reliable.

        To summarize, the royal brothers from Dubai’s safety was considered an immediate concern, hence their round-the-clock use of limousine service, and an airplane was granted permission to fly out of Lexington Ky 48 hours after 9/11, apparently unnoticed (I assume during the night). As an aside, my handful of less well-off Arab students were telling me they were worried about their safety during that timeframe too, but didn’t report receiving any special considerations.

        Rules do not apply to the elite.

  2. nonclassical

    ..seems beyond any doubt there has been a “cover-up”…too many questions unanswered, events unexplored. Media did virtually no job at all of investigating…building 7 (5 excuses for falling-nothing hit it), Pentagon (missing cameras=documentation), LIES by those testifying at “911 Commission” (Condi Rice caught in LIE), while testimony of 911 witnesses cannot be found=not in “911 Commission Report”, and Kissinger’s role, and
    Israeli-american dual citizenship official who replaced him.

    Most comprehensive literary work I have seen is Paul Thompson’s, “The Terror Timeline”..Thompson is who families of 911 victims turned to, following, to cause an investigation which was stonewalled. Read the book, composed of international media stories, and more..

    Discover FBI agent Colleen Rowley, FBI translator Sybil Edwards (gag order),
    “Able-Danger” FBI investigative team, “Buzzy” Krongard, with FBI, then Deutche
    Bank (millions of $$$ of “puts” on United and American airlines placed by Deutche employee, just prior to 911), then Krongard shows up at “Blackwater”.

    Google up Buzzy Krongard…

    1. Dirk

      Shucks, why don’t you just link to Architects and Engineers for 9/11 Truth?

      They have some great videos of Building Seven falling
      into a neat little pile and taking all the
      ENRON and SEC documents of the crimes of the 90’s with

      The howler that I like is police commisioner
      Bernard Kerick belatedly finding
      Atta’s intact passport that somehow survived while everything else on the plane vaporized and then as a
      pat on the head for his plum, getting to become the gauliter of Iraq before bad luck caught up with him back
      in the U.S.

      Of course if you believe in hundreds of unlikely coincidences then you are a coincidence theorist.

      1. Walter Wit Man

        I think the movie Loose Change is a good introduction to a lot of these basic facts. And it’s done in an interesting way. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7866929448192753501

        But, (and this is a huge caveat) that movie, as well as the Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth, don’t go far enough. In fact, they may even be gatekeepers or controlled opposition. Actually, I’m pretty sure the Loose Change guys are perps based on the hatchet job they did on September Clues (I know, it’s shocking enough to question 9/11, but then the wary researcher has to learn about plots within the plot–hey, the truth is stranger than fiction–what can I say).

        So maybe I should recommend September Clues as the first movie to see, even though it is a bit more difficult to follow (not that people will or should take my recommendation–but I share b/c I find it fascinating). You can watch the movie at the website: http://septemberclues.info/

        This is the major discovery about 9/11. The perps used the media to pull off the attack. It’s likely that most of the 3,000 people that were reported killed that day were not killed.

        1. LeonovaBalletRusse

          WWM, you’re hot on the trail of these perps in collusion, so will you tell us what you find on John O’Neill, detested by Bush’s FBI, who had to be eliminated?

          1. Walter Wit Man

            Good eye LBR.

            Looks like another perp to me. Notice the cover of being a “whistle blower” re these very allegations about Saudi Arabia, and then getting martyred in the towers.

            I don’t buy it.

            He likely got a new identity. This was probably a clue that was intentionally left back then, like many of the other Saudi clues. And remember, this was happening with Israel and Pakistan too.

            It’s possible I guess. But everyone had evacuated and the only reason for him to be in there was if he was in on the scam.

            I’m putting him on my perp list.

            I now this all seems weird to people but if you had a huge black op budget this is the type of stuff you would do. It exists.

      2. Karl Rove's Brain

        Waiting for an Occamstard to tell us that just because two Senators said Saudi Arabia might have been involved in 9/11, that doesn’t mean we should take these senators who actually sifted through the evidence as seriously as we should take an anonymous social media commenter. Because commenters are never trolls or paid PR hacks.

        New rule: from here on out anyone who cites former Senators as “authorities” on anything at all should be dismissed as tin foil hat wearers. Hopefully, we will shame other readers into thinking, “Gosh, I don’t want to be mocked as a conspiracy theorist, I suppose I’d rather ignore what senators who studied the evidence said, and instead allow myself to be pressured by an anonymous troll.”


          1. Up the Ante

            Not calling KRB a troll, just want to know what Leonova thinks of the possibility of a “troll” evolving into a super-troll, and then into a human ?

            1. Lambert Strether

              I’ve got a Turing Test field that users have to fill in to prove they’re human. Not an arithmetic test, but a sentence or paragraph of real prose. One time I got “Why are you doing this? I’m only trying to make a living!” from some Bangladeshi, or Indian, or Filipino… Should have connected with them, I guess….

          2. Karl Rove's Brain

            Ouch. That hurt. Okay, I will try to behave, cross my brain and hope to die.

            Good idea about troll evolving into upright-walking creature. I may steal that. Glad I thought of it!

          3. Up the Ante

            “Glad I thought of it.”
            Yes, of course.

            Plots within plots. Seems upon considering plots within plots that even trolls will be forced to evolve into something more real than a troll or evolve into something that negates the original purpose of the trolling.

      3. LeonovaBalletRusse

        Dirk, the ruin of the SEC docs on ENRON is a “tell” — time to BUST BUSHES.

        1. JamesW

          Plus 2,000 plus ongoing SEC investigations: no original source documents, no trials, and end of investigations!

    2. LeonovaBalletRusse

      n, yes, “Buzzy Krongard’ is KEY to so much malefaction. He has “made his living” as an occult “general factotum” for the Reich under the CIA umbrella.

      1. JamesW

        Not trying to excuse either of the Krongard brothers here, but that firm, Alex Browne, was owned at that time by Deutsche Bank — a most crucial and overlooked fact.

        And I always stick with the facts, those puts were truly spare change compared to missing trillions that day.

        1. nonclassical

          right…great connection-Alex Browne banking…absorbed by Deutche Bank..Browne was CIA (front?) involved with Iran-Contra-drugs-$$$$, etc…

          There is some great info regarding “Buzzy” Krongard, if one searches…banking,
          CIA, Blackwater, so much more…how did Deutche get involved with “puts” on United and American Airlines…all that info is now largely hidden. It shows there was definite foreknowledge of 911…but so do many of Paul Thompson’s

    3. harposox

      I highly recommend Michael Ruppert’s “Crossing the Rubicon,” and also his work from the “From the Wilderness” newsletter (which is still available online). He’s responsible for much of the seminal 9/11 reporting and analysis.

      1. LeonovaBalletRusse

        harposox, Ruppert is a true patriot in reality; he took huge risks for We the People’s nation. He should be getting the Congressional Medal of Honor.

    4. LeonovaBalletRusse

      n, it has been suggested that the plane that “went down” in PA was actually meant to hit Building 7, but that this plan failed. It makes sense that another plane was to hit Building 7 to make it look like that was the reason for the pancaking of that building. When it didn’t show up, the conspirators had to complete their plan for destruction anyway, so it went down. After that we began to hear the recent owner tell his story about how he ordered them to “PULL it,” in order to justify its collapse. The necessity for “pulling it” to make a pattern of destruction complete, EVEN THOUGH doing this put the plan at risk of later discovery, might add to the argument that the whole conflagration was an act of “Magick,” well planned in advance, by psychopathic occultists (Bush Dynasty of Global 1%]. See YouTube for occult practices of kids under teacher instruction as Bushie sat at attention with “My Pet Goat” in his hands, waiting expectantly. One possibility:

      “Do You Believe in Magick? (4of6)” [see all segments: 1-6 for whole view.

  3. Waking Up

    Former Presidents George H.W. Bush and his
    son George W. Bush both have a long family
    history of “friendly” and business interests
    with the Saudi Royal family. All of this
    needs to be thoroughly investigated instead
    of the B.S. position of “look forward, not

    1. JamesW

      Believe it already has been:

      Brothers: The Hidden History of the Kennedy Years, by David Talbot

      JFK and the Unspeakable, by James Douglass

      A Terrible Secret, by H.P. Albarelli, Jr.

      Family of Secrets, by Russ Baker

      1. LeonovaBalletRusse

        Ray, one of the “tells” of corruption, and ominous, is the connection between the Bushes and Tom Ridge of PA in the ENRON scam. After 911 Tom Ridge became the first head of Homeland Security, as is known. But there is so much we do not know, even though Kevin Phillips connects the dots exceedingly well. The Appendices are especially worthy of note. Really, nothing in this intelligent book should be passed over or ignored.

      2. sgt_doom

        No offense intended Mr. Ray D., but one must very, very carefully regarding that Phillips fellow.

        Sure, he made some interesting dot connections with that book, but Phillips would next blame the economic meltdown on the CPI, for chrissakes!!!

        Also, Phillips routinely just about only attends the US Chamber of Commerce circuit when he’s going on book tours (those are the City Clubs located around the country he only speaks at).

        Many other telltales which indicate Phillips is a member of a rather large group of misdirection and redirection specialists, always suggesting looking somewhere else, or “it just happened” or “nobody could have foreseen it” or it was just all those “super-bright guys full of themselves and making the usual mistakes” — i.e., the same suspects who always walk away with the billions and trillions, leaving the rest of us out in the cold.

    2. Walter Wit Man

      See here for the connection between George H.W. Bush and 9/11: http://anationbeguiled.wordpress.com/2011/11/05/bush%E2%80%99s-project-hammer-and-the-911-deception/

      It describes how Project Hammer was done with the help of Greenspan to crush the Soviet Union using economic warfare.

      The securities/bonds associated with this and other black ops were coming due and they were “cleared” that day when they were destroyed in the attacks (the $1 billion in gold was moved prior to the attacks).

      It’s an amazing story and talks about the Black Eagle Trust.

      1. LeonovaBalletRusse

        WWM, smoking link. Cry Treason! Arrest, detain, indict, convict George H.W. Bush, George W. Bush for Treason while in Office of President, of Abuse of Power, of Crimes AGainst Humanity, of War Crimes, of Organized Crime, of Treason. Authors of PNAC must be indicted for Treason and Crimes also, as must may others mentioned in the Walter Wit Man link above to “A Nation Beguiled…”

        The “Ideological Cover” for Bush Dynasty crimes from the Third Reich through Fourth Reich IV (Holy Roman Reich III-IV) remains the same: “war against Communism”–totally bogus. George H.W. Bush is the “Anglo-American Establishment” Agent while President/Commander in Chief of the U.S.A., and the “Eminence Grise” (Shadow Godfather) thereafter, for the destruction and looting of RUSSI via “Project Hammer” and of “9/11” therafter. His son, George W. Bush, covered up the crimes by removing presidential records to an undisclosed locatlion (theft/destruction of evidence–Kevin Phillips covers this also in “American Dynasty”), and as President/Commander in Chief ordered the execution of “9/11” – the “War on Terre” and its looting for Private Profit thereafter – the Destruction of Constitutional Law for the establishment of a Dictatorship with him as the *Decider*. Thus father and son are equal TRAITORS while in in office as President/Commander in Chief.

        Follow the money and the DNA of just one Bush Dynasty Name in the Game for private profiteering from the Third Reich through the Fourth Reich: BROWN:
        Brown Brothers Harriman, Brown & Root, KBR, Alexander Brown & Sons, Deutsche Bank’s Alex Brown, “Heckuva Job Brownie”. Only CONNECT.

        “A Nation Beguiled: Bush’s Project Hammer and the 911 Deception” by Deanna Spingola is a masterpiece of indictment.

        YVES, she connects the criminal Black Eagle Trust with Marcos Gold and the Golden Lily Treasure. This information connects with the financial scandal related by Lord James of Blackheath to the House of Lords, and to the YouTube video:

        “NEW Benjamin Fulford UPDATE 01/04/2012 116 Trillion dolar deposit” (The1stWarning on Jan 3, 2012), which shows the newspaper photo of persons at a table, with details in print below it: “THE TRILATERAL SOCIETY OF GLOBAL FUNDERS HELD IN GENEVA, CONFERENCE CR. 1984” showing signatures of: “Pres. Fernando E. Marcos, Tiburcio Villamor Marcos–sole Owner, Representative of Bank of International Settlements Boston and Switzerland, Union Bank of Switzerland Officer” and of: “Elizabeth R: Trilateral Nations” and of: Ronald Reagan: President of the United States of America”. On http://www.youtube.com

        The Lord James of Blackheath report may be seen at: http://www.youtube.com:

        “Lord James of Blackheath FOUNDATION X UPDATE February 16 2012” (allmoderncons on Feb 17, 2012)

        My fellow Americans, “Let’s roll.”

    3. nonclassical

      …you mean you find bushbama difficult to believe?? Shocked, shocked…

      You may find the historical documentation on bushfamilyco in Kevin Phillips’
      book, “American Dynasty”…and Phillips was Nixon’s economist-editorialist..

    1. Walter Wit Man

      I may be talking my book (If I’m using this phrase correctly), but it seems to me there was a lot of interest during the 10 year anniversary and people started looking into the facts more. Plus, the ability to shut down the skeptics has worn off. There was a huge amount of propaganda discouraging people from not questioning. I remember Bill Maher in particular.

      But the truth is coming out and more people are seeing it so they are moving on to the next cover story.

      1. Walter Wit Man

        And I have to admit I was one of those people that thought it was crazy to question the story of 9/11. But when I saw people like Bill Maher work hard to delegitimize 9/11 truthers it rubbed me the wrong way.

        But it still took until last summer before I had the courage to look at the facts re 9/11. The perps made the attack shocking to have this effect on us. Same thing with the Kennedy assassination.

        1. LeonovaBalletRusse

          WWM, that’s right: They overplayed their hand in desperation, cuz THEY GOT NUTHIN to counteract the truth/reality discovered especially by the Physicists and Architects for 911 truth, among others.

          The Commission that created the 911 Report ought to be BUSTED, esp. because Hamilton is from INDIANA. Can you guess what he might be covering up, and who he might be covering up for? “Do you believe in Magick?”

          1. rjlaures

            From the day those towers came down I believed it was a controlled demolition for one reason only. I can not fathom how two different causes, planes hitting the towers and controlled demolition, could result in such a similar reaction, not only once but twice. Since then I heard a high school physics teacher did some measurements and showed that those buildings were in freefall and he posed the question, how can anybody deny what is out there for all the world to see? I still believe it was a controlled demolition.

        2. nonclassical


          it’s soooo important to jump on events as-when they happen..before disinformation sets in. Again, this is what Paul Thompson did, allowing families of 911 victims to question Kissinger-forcing him to remove himself from 911 commission head…great story there, also..

    2. Bev

      Why now? Fate of the world…

      I recently saw the following and would like a journalist to follow up on this.


      It is about a Bush appointee Dov Zakheim to Comptroller of the Pentagon, and that during his management an audit showed over three trillion dollars were missing.

      Before that he work for Systems Planning Corporation which has the technology to remote control any plane, to hijack or hijack a hijacked plane…



      Fatal Holes that Sink Bush’s 911 Lie
      by Len Hart, The Existentialist Cowboy

      History is being re-written as we write, speak or post. American Airlines itself was the source for my blog article of about 2 years ago in which it was revealed that Flight 11 did not fly nor had been scheduled to fly on 911.

      The TIP off was a Wikipedia article which had been revised to reflect the truth about Flight 11. However, I wanted confirmation that it was, indeed, American Airlines, that was making the change. This I was able to confirm with a WHOIS look-up of the IP address making the change. It was –indeed –AA itself that was the source of the Wiki change that now said that Flight 11 was not even scheduled to fly on 911, had been mothballed for some 6 months as I recall. There is no information that it had been pressed into service at the 11th hour. There is simply no evidence that supports the Bush theory with respect to any of the alleged flights whatsoever.

      In my opinion, that’s better documentation than Woodward-Bernstein got from ‘Deep Throat’. But –as Orwell taught us –history is re-written daily these days. The best that we can to is point out how UTTERLY IMPOSSIBLE (if not ludicrous) is the Bush ‘official conspiracy theory of 911’.


      1. Bev


        If flights 11 or 77 did not fly on 911, officialdom must come up with another explanation to explain the the events of 911.

        No wreckage traceable to a 757 was ever found at the Pentagon.

        One would not expect to find wreckage of a flight never flown. What is significant with respect to the changes to Wiki, with respect to BTS/NTSB records is that the burden of proof is now placed upon Bushco to prove its theory. Bush et al should be compelled to prove the official theory –or face charges resulting from the probable cause that Bush himself and high ranking members of his administration participated in the crimes of mass murder and high treason!

        Photos of an engine rotor appear to depict an engine used in the Global Hawk, a payload carrying missile that was, according to Britain’s International Television News, flown from the US to Australia completely by remote control. “A robot plane has made aviation history by becoming the first unmanned aircraft to fly across the Pacific Ocean.”

        Britain’s ITN continued:

        “The Global Hawk, a jet-powered aircraft with a wingspan equivalent to a Boeing 737, flew from Edwards Air Force Base in California and landed late on Monday at the Royal Australian Air Force base at Edinburgh, in South Australia state… It flies along a pre-programmed flight path, but a pilot monitors the aircraft during its flight via a sensor suite which provides infra-red and visual images.”

        ITN quoted Australian Global Hawk manager Rod Smith: “The aircraft essentially flies itself, right from takeoff, right through to landing, and even taxiing off the runway.”

        ‘The Missile that Struck this Building’ –Don Rumsfeld

        The Global Hawk is a much better candidate for what Rumsfeld called ‘…the missile that struck this building’ than a 757. Here’s what you need to know about the Pentagon.

        Only minutes after the strike, [see pic above] there is no sign of an airliner at all!!
        No wreckage traceable to a 757 was ever recovered.
        Only ONE engine rotor (seen in photos) was recovered! This rotor is about one third the diameter of a 757 rotor, i.e about the size of a U.S. Global Hawk rotor.
        A 757 has two rotors, each of which are nearly three times the size of the SINGLE rotor located at the Pentagon. Again –only one rotor was found in Pentagon debris.
        Engine rotors are made of a Steel/Titanium alloy to withstand high temps inside jet engines and would have been found had they been there.
        Flight 77 could not and did not crash into the Pentagon. That may be because Flt 77 had been mothballed and had not flown for some 6 months and that’s according to airline records.

        No Arabs Were on Board 77

        If no Arabs were on board Flight 77, Bush’s theory must be trashed! There is not only no evidence to support the theory that Arab terrorists hijacked 77, there is every reason to believe that none of ever got on board. There are no Arabs on the only Pentagon ‘evidence’ that is admissible in court: the ‘Official Autopsy Report’ of Pentagon victims.

        The autopsy report was released to Dr. Olmsted in response to his FOIA request. In a ‘neat’ cover-up, a 911 memorial lists all victims of whatever it was that crashed into the Pentagon. At the same time, 77 victims were said to have been buried at Arlington National Cemetery. All are Pentagon employees! Where, then, are the passengers buried? I would be very surprised to learn that there were passengers on a flight that cannot be proven to have existed.

        Whatever crashed into the Pentagon was described by a witnesses as looking like a ‘hump-backed whale’. Rumsfeld himself called it a missile: Below: a US Global Hawk painted to look like an AA airliner. It is both a ‘missile’ and it also has a hump back! It ‘fills the bill’.

        The photo below does not purport to be the craft that would ultimately crash into the Pentagon. It merely demonstrates how easily such a ‘paint job’ could dupe those who are 1) not experts on aircraft 2) saw it only for a second or less as it scooted across the Pentagon lawn as NO 757 could possibly have done 3) were, in any case, caught off guard.

        Recognizing lies for what they are is a part of the process of growing up! America, it is time to grow up! It is time to confront this heinous pack of lies! It is time to insist that the Obama administration begin a REAL investigation of 911.

        1. LeonovaBalletRusse

          Bev, great discovery. Isn’t it strange that G.W. Bush was flown down to the air force base in Louisiana? The arch corruption of Louisiana seems to be a part of every dirty game, especially since its joined at the hip with filthy Texas.

      2. Attitude_Check

        I worked with a person who was on flight 11. He never came back. I worked closely with a man scheduled on flight 11, but he took a red eye the previous night at the last minute. He made it back.

        1. ohmyheck

          “He never came back.” This does not prove that he died in an airliner crash. It doesn’t even prove that he died. It only proves that he disappeared. Who knows what really happened to him.

          1. Walter Wit Man

            Yes. Most likely no one died on Flight 11. There were many funny facts about Flight 11 (as well as the other flights).

            For instance, according to the BTS database flights 11 did not take off that day. Also, the flight was scheduled for maintenance that day, not a flight.


            Also, lots of the alleged passengers on the 4 planes were either in the military or military contractors.

            When one looks into the identities of these airline passengers, it becomes obvious that they are fake personas or some funny business is going on. For instance, here is an evaluation of two Flight 11 passengers who appear to be fake: http://letsrollforums.com/two-m-o-n-t23796.html

            1. Lambert Strether

              OK, I’ll bite. What’s the operational definition of a “fake persona”? And presumably, given that definition, there’s some sort of signature that fake personas have (unless the fake persona is so fake that it might as well be real, rather like Mitt Romney or Lady Gaga or Barack Obama, which takes a lot of money).

          2. Dave of Maryland

            Lambert, faking an ID doesn’t take a lot of money (although it can). Just takes some street smarts.

          3. Walter Wit Man

            It does appear to be pretty easy. To fully understand it one really should take the time to wade through one of the let’s roll, or September Clues, forum threads on this subject. It is pretty amazing what a committed group of activist researchers can figure out.

            One sees a lot of similarities in the fake personae:

            1) there usually/often is only two photographs of the “victim.” This two photos are often a composite of the same basic photo. Also, many of the same composites seem to have been reused.

            2) These photos are often of poor quality. There were a couple of major online memorials (like CNN) and it’s inconceivable that so many family members put up really crappy phots of their loved ones.

            3) The memorials themselves are also suspicious. The 9/11 hoax was done before the internet became so widely used so the perps really messed up in creating online background stories for the “victims”. Most of the background stories read the same way. If you really dig into these people you start seeing a lot of similarities–lots of neoliberal heroes, 30 year old bond traders that volunteer as Big Brothers and do adventure sports in the off time. Shit like that–but it really becomes more convincing once you dig in and see it in action. It’s hard to explain . . .

            4) Most victims are not in the Social Security Death Index. Normally there is about a 80% hit rate if you type in a deceased family member. Only a very few of the “victims” of 9/11 made it on this list. Again, the perps skimped on the follow up back story creation.

            5) Hired actors. Many of the victims’ family members appear to be hired actors. Heck, the one lady that represented victim families, and palled around with Guiliani, etc., was proved to be fake but of course they pretended she was just a crazy lady and it was a lone incident.

            I’ve linked to the research into Ingeborg Lariby before and this is interesting because she appears to be one of the few real people but her business may have been intimately involved with creating a lot of the fake identities. http://letsrollforums.com/ingeborg-lariby-key-figure-t21912.html

            But there are dozens of great threads where you really have to dig into the details. It seems weird at first but you begin to discover that there is no other way to uncover a deception like this other than reviewing all your assumptions and looking at the best original evidence.

          4. Lambert Strether

            @Dave Fake ID isn’t the same at all as “fake persona”

            @WWM If you were writing a project proposal for the number of fake personas required, what would the budget and timelines be?

          5. Bev

            Lambert, are you/NC going to fund certain lines of investigation regarding 911. So fantastic. Thanks.

        1. Bev

          The audit(s) of over 3 Trillion Dollars missing, was from two separate audits–the first amount mentioned by Rumsfeld and a second audit a few years later.

      3. Walter Wit Man

        Yes indeed Bev. On September 10, 2001 Donald Rumsfeld announced a “war” on the Pentagon he would wage because of the over $2 Trillion missing. The investigators and files were supposedly moved to the part of the Pentagon that was attacked and the auditors were not able to complete their audit as part of Rumsfeld’s war because of the attack. There were also Navy intelligence personell in the part of the Pentagon that was attacked.

        After 9/11 of course these questions about missing trillions would be ignored as the U.S. went on a massive military spending binge. Only to have the issue repeat again 10 years later with missing trillions from the wars.

        Also, regarding the financial motive of the perps:

        1. The victims compensation fund gave over $4 Billion to families (averaging just under $2 million per person), but the far greater fund that most people aren’t aware of is the business compensation fund. I think over $40 Billion (from the top of my head) was given to businesses that supposedly lost people.

        2. Larry Silverstein’s insurance claims resulted in around $6 Billion.

        3. I’m sure individual tenants had insurance claims as well.

        4. The victims memorials and funds were established right after 9/11, in many cases websites were set up within the week. Many “victims” hawk books and memorial items, etc. The mourning business has been good to the perps.

        5. The contractors that built the building (maybe mob related) probably got paid and didn’t have to deliver such things as concrete.

        6. Of course military contractors and others made a huge windfall with the war on terror and the government spending on all things related to security.

        7. The records destroyed in Building 7 probably helped people. Enron’s records and many other SEC records were destroyed (not that they would have pursued these cases with vigor anyway).

        There are probably many other profit motives but these right here amount to trillions.

      4. Walter Wit Man

        Side note: in my review of a certain cult and the strange connections it had to people I suspect of being government assets/agents, I came to see Wikipedia as a fraud. I had heard about it but never really believed it until I saw it first hand on I subject I had researched.

        There was a book and a few very factual articles written about this person in the 90s and at one point someone edited the Wikipedia page to reflect this accurate information, the only public information about this person. But the wikipedia page keeps getting messed with to erase reference to the only published reports of this person and it is incredibly favorable to the perp subject.

        Oh, and btw, the person is connected to Silicon Valley and Wikipedia so that could explain it. But since I suspect this cult, I of course suspect the Wikipedia-related perp because he is associated with the cult.

        1. LeonovaBalletRusse

          WWM, congratulations. You see why Wikipedia must be viewed with the utmost skepticism.

        2. Dave of Maryland

          Hello Walt, You’re speaking of Stanley Anne Dunham’s Wiki page, no doubt.

          1. Walter Wit Man

            Oh, she. Obama’s mother’s wiki page doesn’t mention she was in the CIA but does provide clues like:

            From January 1981 to November 1984, Dunham was the program officer for women and employment in the Ford Foundation’s Southeast Asia regional office in Jakarta.

            But I don’t see anything for 1985-86.

            Then in 87-88 she is in Pakistan under similar CIA cover. She was in a prime location in the early 80s for the creation of Al Qaeda. Her bank is also an alleged conduit for intelligence work.

          2. nonclassical

            ..someone needs to uncover the incredible sums-CIA-surveillance-military going to Indonesia over the last 50 years or so…?

            Intel in Indonesia is very, very unstated…what it’s all about, what it’s for, who.
            where, when, how..

            Amy Goodman’s tiny involvement sheds some light on the subject…and media
            disinformation regarding..

          3. LeonovaBalletRusse

            WWM, re “Mindfuckers” see the totalitarian frame: nothing left to chance:

            “THE IDEOLOGY OF TYRANNY: Bataille, Foucault, and the Postmodern Corruption of Political Dissent” by Guido Giacomo Preparata (New York, Palgrave Macmillan, 2007). Leo Strauss’s “economics” figured prominently into this plan.

    3. Susan the other

      I was just wondering that. Because we have almost accomplished our goal. And now we are willing to expose the Saudi royals? But aren’t they still our staunch partners? It’s creepy because war with Iran is all but exploding.

        1. nonclassical

          ..yet Greg Pallast reveals big oil interests choosing to go with OPEC over bushit
          attempts to control middle-east oil…

          interesting conflagration 2004, as James Baker, George HW Bushit, attempt to
          “go back to the business of business”…talk neocons down from destabilization-
          profiteer-shock doctrine exploitation…

    4. Bev

      Yes Lambert, why now when last I posted on this subject, it was worthy of cussing me. It wouldn’t have anything to do with two servers, would it?

        1. Bev

          Maybe so Lambert, if it is the addition/upgrade after the recent take down of the site.

          I don’t know enough tech to know if that is a problem to me or NC. How do you verify between the twin servers? What are possibilities if unverifiable. Is that something that is done, or never done?

          I wondered about your own change of feeling–to be angry then and okay now, increasingly so even after posting this unsatisfying george washington story. Where is the better work of george washington?

          I think comment postings are interesting and helpful.

          Why now for you? What changed your mind a little, then more?

    5. JamesW

      Well….on this 10th anniversary, a radio special appeared on NPR, financed by Booz Allen (curiously enough), which shed first-time light on the fact that the Defense Intelligence Agency’s Financial Management Group was called in for a last-minute emergency meeting (they mentioned some email sent out around 2:00 to 3:00 AM on the morning of 9/11, calling the group for a meeting at their staff room right by the Pentagon’s west wall (point of aircraft — or whatever — impact).

      In this special — broadcast on the West Coast (USA) at 2:00 AM on the 10th anniversary, for some reason) a lady professional and member of the DIA’s FMG, stated how she had overslept that morning, thus viewed the email late and arrived at the Pentagon late, which saved her life as she viewed — from a safe distance — the aircraft crashing into the Pentagon’s west wall (truly peculiar and a most complicated and difficult maneuver — any real suicide pilot would have crashed into the Pentagon from above, thereby doing more damage, killing more people, and a much easier approach????).

  4. Walter Wit Man

    The elite commissioners of a government-sponsored investigation would never lie! For example, see the Warren Commission.

    The cover story that the Saudis did it is the backup cover story.

    The first cover story was that 19 Al Qaeda terrorists did it. But that started being discarded back about 2006, when Cheney claimed he never said there were direct ties to Bin Laden and 9/11. The FBI never sought Bin Laden for the attacks because of a lack of evidence. Bin Laden denied it. They have been laying the groundwork on this for a while. Hell, right after the attacks we were getting these leaks re Saudi Arabia.

    But it’s just a cover. Saudi Arabia is our bitch (we don’t even need to attack). They know their role is to be the backup patsy and are playing along.

    Israel will be the next backup patsy, if needed. That cover has been carefully laid as well. There were multiple Israelis arrested on 9/11 either carrying bombs or cheering after the first strike. My guess is they were jr. partners in the attack, maybe planting the explosives (one of the Israelis that was detained was an special forces explosives expert). I bet their U.S. perps called the cops on them so they would be arrested so they would have this cover story to roll out later (devious–I know-but look how effective it would be–plus the perps controlled our government so they knew the Israelis would be released).

    So I’m tempted to cheer when mainstream politicians and others “ask questions” about 9/11 and want another investigation. I agree. But it goes much further than this. This was a massive false flag operation with a huge profit motive and huge political motive. Shifting the blame to Israel or Saudi Arabia or Pakistan won’t help.

    These commissioners know more of the truth than they are letting on and it goes well beyond Saudi Arabia.

    1. Karl Rove's Brain

      You know too much. You have the whole thing worked out. We cannot allow this. You just had to go and blab, didn’t you? Well, now we’re going to have to silence you.

    2. LeonovaBalletRusse

      WWM, someone recently called “Israel” our “aircraft carrier” in the Middle East. Make that “the aircraft carrier for the Anglo-American Empire” in the M.E. The Bush Dynasty are Blud Brudders of the Victorian German Holy Roman Reich II-III-IV. Just follow the money from the Opium Wars of Pax Britannica to the Opium Wars of Pax Americana by Bush/Russell et al. for “God and Man at YALE.”

    3. nonclassical

      there are several SA involvements…emmisary to Iraq was asked by Saddam, whether U.S. would have any interest should he attack Quwait, as they were drilling sideways into Iraq fields..Iraq still has more than 80% of their easily refined sweet crude…emmisary stated must check with D.C., did, then reported
      U.S. would have no such interest. Sooo, Saddam invaded-immediately, U.S. informed SA Saddam had them next on list, and oh, by the way, would they like
      U.S. military on the ground for protection…SA stammered an affirmative..likely
      trusting bushitters. U.S. troops go into “holy land”, Osama becomes more “involved”, is on CIA payroll..? Was SA set up? Is that cause of Greg Pallast reported SA backlash against U.S. interests Iraq, after SA stated they would make up any difference in oil delivery, if U.S. invaded Iraq? What about SA today-they-U.S. interests seem contrary…? What about OPEC?-cost of oil?
      Intransigence of U.S. moving to renewable energy, in light of success in Germany of so doing? (30% of total energy resources renewable, over only last
      5 years)

      1. LeonovaBalletRusse

        n. I recall reading that the Power did want to get away from SA control of oil.

  5. Hugh

    The 9/11 Commission was the best of the inquiries into the attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, and it was hopelessly compromised. Here is a short recap of the Commission I dredged up from something I wrote ages ago:

    Although now largely forgotten, the Bush Administration fought the 9/11 Commission every step of the way and it was only pressure from the American public and most especially from the families of the victims of 9/11 that the commission was formed and was able to come up with some kind of a report however flawed and incomplete.

    Bush and Cheney resisted calls for such a bipartisan commission for over a year arguing that the matter was best left to Republican controlled intelligence committees in the Congress. It was not until November 27, 2002 that Bush announced the commission’s formation. He did his best to see that it went nowhere. Members were to be chosen by both Congress and the White House raising questions about the commission’s independence. Democratic co-chair George Mitchell on December 11, 2002 and Republican chair Henry Kissinger (whom the White House had insisted on appointing) on December 13, 2007 resigned due to conflicts of interest. Kissinger did not want to make public the financial records (and connections) of his security consulting company Kissinger Associates. Tom Kean and Lee Hamilton were named to replace them. The specter of conflicts of interest remained. Through their careers in government and on corporate boards, essentially all of the commission members had such conflicts. Perhaps the most egregious of these was Philip Zelikow the commission’s executive staff director who had worked closely with Condoleezza Rice on the National Security Council in the first Bush Administration and co-written a book with her.

    Bush also tried to limit the commission’s activities by giving it a budget of only $3 million to investigate the biggest terrorist attack in the country’s history. The Challenger investigation cost $50 million by comparison. Later Kean and Hamilton asked for a further $11 million to be included in the $75 billion supplemental slated to fund the invasion of Iraq. The White House initially refused the funds before reversing itself.

    The White House also placed many roadblocks in the commission’s path slowing its work. The commission was originally given 18 months or to the end of May 2004 to make its report. When a 60 day extension was requested, this too was initially denied. The commission report was eventually released on July 22, 2004.

    The White House sought both to shape and limit testimony. Before former counter-terrorism chief Richard Clarke testified, then White House counsel Alberto Gonzales contacted two commission members Fred Fielding and James Thompson with information to discredit Clarke which they duly presented.

    On Presidential Daily Briefs, after dragging its heels for months, the White House allowed them to be viewed by only 4 of the 10 commissioners who were to report back to the others. However, the White House denied the full commission access to the notes made by the 4 approved commissioners. Moreover, of 360 PDBs requested, only 24 were made available by White House counsel Alberto Gonzales. On March 14, 2004, the White House finally responded to the commission by releasing a 17 page summary of PDBs related to al Qaeda from the Bush and Clinton Administrations.

    The White House refused requests for National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice to testify. The rationale given was that historically National Security Advisers had not testified before Congress. This was completely untrue, and Rice finally testified on April 8, 2004. Rice’s testimony, however, came with the price that no other White House aides were to be called.

    Bush initially placed a one hour limit on his testimony before the commission. This was rejected. But his testimony was highly conditioned. On April 29, 2004, he and Dick Cheney together met with the commission in private with no oath or transcript and only one staffer to take notes which were not to be made public.

    Finally, it should be remembered the 9/11 Commission was bipartisan. This does not mean the same thing as non-partisan. In order to achieve consensus, there was a deliberate decision not to assign personal blame. This was a critical shortcoming. Because as the Bush Administration’s repeated obstruction of the investigation into its complacency and inaction before 9/11 showed, it had much to hide.

    Government commissions and inquiries are much more about damage control than they are about establishing the truth. They provide the theatrics of process but are chiefly there to spin and hide the facts. It’s interesting that these stories on Kerrey and Graham have come out now but you have to remember that these guys are seekers after truth but rather insiders engaged in some inside baseball.

    I pointed out Saudi and Pakistani connections to terrorism on this site just a few days ago, and what I was saying has been known for years. This comment is already too long but I would just say that the Saudi monarchy is both deeply corrupt and deeply autocratic. It has only one goal, its own survival. So 9/11 was not Saudi policy, but turning a blind eye to the funding of radicals, even by members of Saudi’s extended royal family, as long as their efforts were not directed against the monarchy itself was. You see that was bin Laden’s big sin in the eyes of Saudi leaders. He wanted to overthrow the monarchy. His wanting to kill Americans was seen as no more than a nuisance. Saudi leaders were themselves perfectly willing to see as many dead Americans as it took to defend their state in the First Gulf War. Afterwards when it became politically inconvenient, they had no problem kicking Americans forces out of their country. And that by the way was a prime neocon strategic motivation for the invasion of Iraq, replacing Saudi bases with Iraqi ones.

    1. different clue

      You raise much bigger deeper questions and issues than the side-matter I raised just below. A very interesting blog exists with a whole pack of articles about serious questions about the who/what/why of the 9/11 attacks. That blog is called Rigorous Intuition 2.0 (because it is a slight up-date on its Rigorous Intuition predecessor). Here is the link.

      (It also has a section of posts about “Katrina”, which some have referred to as The Federal Flood and Operation Drown NOLA).

    2. Max424

      “9/11 was not Saudi policy, but turning a blind eye to the funding of radicals, even by members of Saudi’s extended royal family, as long as their efforts were not directed against the monarchy itself was.”

      Agree, completely. The Kingdom is made up of a series of princely fiefdoms and sub-fiefdoms. Each of them is rich; many of them are so rich they could, at any moment (and with some punch), project themselves into the Big Shell Game –all without either authorization, or validation, from above.

      “…a prime neocon strategic motivation for the invasion of Iraq, replacing Saudi bases with Iraqi ones.”

      Yup. And now those Iraqi bases are gone. Our Afghan bases, at present, are cut off by land. Even when they’re not, they’re so remote as to make them –almost– more bother than they’re worth.

      The goal since the late 70’s has been to power project into the middle east by ringing it with bases. Mainly, the intention was to always “gently remind” the Saudi’s of the need to adhere to their end of the vital ’75 petrodollar agreement.

      As for a possible invasion of The Kingdom? Why not? It would simplify matters; for what better place is there for us to keep “an eye” on the Arabian peninsula, than to take up permanent residence therein?

      It’s better than dealing with Yemen, and that fake state Bahrain, or worst of all, putting all our eggs in expensive carrier groups that are floating in the middle of a potential, Gulf free fire zone.

      1. Walter Wit Man

        I agree with both you and Hugh that the U.S. wanted to reposition bases.

        But I don’t think the Saudis kicked the U.S. out. It’s more likely the U.S. didn’t need bases there because Saudi Arabia was a solid ally and the U.S. wanted to project into other areas. Plus, they are arming Saudi Arabia so it’s like a Jr. U.S. army in the region. And look how the U.S. is trying to use this regional military power as a junior partner in things it used to do.

        So the whole bin laden thing demanding the U.S. get out and the Saudi’s “kicking” the U.S. out sounds like a cover story to me.

    3. Walter Wit Man

      So do you think it was Bin Laden?

      The FBI never charge him. Dick Cheney said he never made that connection. Bin Laden denied it. There is no evidence connecting him, or Al Qaeda, yet there is evidence pointing to others.

      I’m curious to hear the Bin Laden or Al Qaeda theory cause now it seems very unlikely.

      Which leaves other Saudi radicals under the Saudis did it theory. So which group was organized enough to pull this off? Renegade princes? What’s the motive and would they really be able to pull this off without the other princes finding out?

      I guess they could use a criminal gang to do the operation . . . but they would absolutely need a lot of support in America. They had to count on America’s air defense system not responding that day, which is a ridiculous assumption. There are many other facts that make it unlikely that any criminal gang was responsible–only powerful nation states had the means to pull it off.

      Which leaves Saudi Arabia the government as the last Saudi possibility. But what’s the motive? Don’t they want to go on living like kings in return for being the premiere toadies to the Americans? They seem to have a zest for the toady role as we are seeing in Libya, Syria, and elsewhere.

      If it is some smaller group of Islamic “terrorists”, I would like to hear a more credible explanation of how they pulled it off.

      I think Saudi Arabia is involved, but mostly as a patsy. They likely know the truth that it was a U.S. false flag attack, but play along.

      1. LeonovaBalletRusse

        WWM, we’re not talking the flunky “Obama” Bin Laden, but the Bin Laden family of Saudi Arabia that “rejected” Osama. This Bin Laden family remained the Construction Lords of Riadh.

        Connect with Curtis and Davis, Architects for Riadh projects from New Orleans in the 1970’s (now defunct); connect with homosexual web between Saudi Prince and New Orleans. See also:

        THE BIN LADENS: An Arabian Family in the American Century” by Steve Coll (New York, The Penguin Press, 2008). Note the size of the Family Tree of the Bin Laden family and the names thereon.

        Recall that Osama Bin Laden was recruited by the CIA of the Bush Dynasty “to fight the Russians in Afghanistan” in the still useful “War Against Communist Aggression” by the Domino Theory. It was then that “al Qaeda” was created.

        Follow the money, follow the oil, follow the construction business whether by Bin Laden Family or by Halliburton and KBR.

        1. LeonovaBalletRusse

          Correct ERROR/slip above: NOT “Obama” but “Osama Bin Laden” — the names really are too close for comfort, aren’t they? And now that Barack Obama is Bush President “All in the Family”, is there any difference? Aren’t all PUPPETS the Agents of a Foreign Power for which G.H.W. Bush’s NWO takes credit?

          1. Walter Wit Man

            Some people claim Obama was [one of] the actor(s) portraying Osama. This is a bit too shocking for even me, but maybe that is precisely why I should suspect it to. I keep learning I am not cynical enough.

            And there is a striking resemblance. Also, Obama’s mother was stationed in Pakistan and he went to visit in the early 80s, most likely when Obama himself was in the CIA.

            Who knows. Sounds crazy to me but the pictures are pretty interesting.

    4. LeonovaBalletRusse

      Hugh, the so-called testimony of Bush-Cheney clearly collusion. Why did the Commission permit this? Could it be because the occult Don George H.W. Bush, the Capo de’ Capi of Holy Roman Reich III-IV’s NWO, insisted upon it? Cheney was the Decider’s consigliere by order of Poppy, that’s clear.

      It’s time to BUST these Agents of a Foreign Power for criminal conspiracy and treason, without delay. File “The Tyrannicide Brief” against the Bush Dynasty to start.

    5. LeonovaBalletRusse

      Hugh, connect Jordan with Queen Noor = Haleby [sp?] of Eastern Airlines lineage.

    6. JamesW

      Sorry to correct your, but I believe you got her name wrong……it’s Kindasleazy Rice!

    7. nonclassical


      Excellent synopsis…add to, fact that prior to 911, bush-cheney-rice-rumsfeld
      were in Naples, Italy, to stay in hotel..but rumor had Osama flying aircraft into
      hotel, so they were placed on boat, run up and down river all night, gunships
      accompanying. Rice’s 911 commission testimony stated, “Noone could have guessed terrorists would hijack aircraft and use them as weapons-flying them into buildings..” Needless to say, this was a LIE. Also, she was confronted regarding her statements to Bush days prior to 911, and forced to admit her
      erroneous position. NONE of said testimony can be found, that I am aware-it is
      completely missing from “911 Commission Report”, as is ALL testimony by ALL witnesses…

  6. different clue

    I saw an interesting comment in a thread once about how/why the twin towers could have fallen so thoroughly and comprehensively. It has to do with the accusation in that comment that I saw . . . that the Mafia Families very much dominated the building trades and the quality of buildings made in NYC at the time the twin towers were built. If that accusation is substantially correct, then the rest of the comment might be interesting. It goes like this: the people who paid for the twin towers got mafia quality work.
    They paid a full price and got quarter price work. Enough of the material in those buildings was, for example, crumblejunk plastercrete instead of concrete; that the buildings were not as strong as what the architects expected they would be.

    Is that worth considering? I don’t know. Its a theory I read in a thread.

      1. Walter Wit Man

        Those guys aren’t looking into the issue the way the guys I point to below are. As far as I know.

        They provide good technical information but their investigation seems to be limited.

      2. Walter Wit Man

        That’s funny.

        I just clicked through the link to 9/11 Architects and Engineers and what was the first story? A FOIA request for the building plans of 9/11!

        Ha. So they are starting to do some of this research that let’s roll and others have been doing.

        But . . .I wonder if they have caught the critical details that they weren’t built to spec.

        1. LeonovaBalletRusse

          WWM, the Architects, Engineers, and Physicists for 911 truth have been working on this for years, and reporting on it piecemeal until they finally created the complex website, showing evidence of their findings coherently.

          1. Walter Wit Man

            I know. I don’t mean to disparage them. They have done some great research, like the scientists that proved there was molten steel present and thus thermite was likely used.

            But the gatekeeper role is a real phenomenon and I get very suspicious when people try to prevent a fruitful line of inquiry.

            The tv fakery is an important revelation and I don’t see how one can ignore this. This is the most sensitive part of the perps’ plan because if the public figures out our media is completely complicit then it will be harder to sell future invasions–like they are doing in Syria now.

          2. LeonovaBalletRusse

            WWM, you definitely have the right attitude for one qualified to participate in democratic process for self-governance with a critical eye.

          3. Walter Wit Man

            Oh no you didn’t.

            In addition to your black bloc crap you’re going to pull crap on media fakery on 9/11. Ok. Thanks for letting me know.

            The entire world on the scam? No.

            If you watch the September Clues movie you will see it’s 20 something media people that act as live witnesses that day. It’s also likely that the live videos were hijacked and many of the people that were working for media that day weren’t aware.

            There is little doubt that the live images we saw that day on the 4 major networks (and BBC) were faked. They’ve been busted. And once you catch them in a little lie like this it has huge implications.

            Also, the “amateur” videos that are later released are obvious fakes.

          4. Walter Wit Man

            Yep. There’s the Lambert I know.

            I clearly say this is not a plot that involves the entire world.

            And you pretend that I said the opposite and it’s a plot that involves the entire world. . .

            Just like when you call me a violence advocate . . .

            1. Lambert Strether

              Irony, Walter. You may say that it doesn’t involve the entire world, and clearly it doesn’t. It doesn’t involve, probably, the Aleutian Islanders, and probably not very many Tibetans. And I think we can both agree on that.

              But the “plot” does keep expanding, balloon-like, to encompass more and more and more and more and more and more, very little of it is falsifiable, there is no theory of the case. What there is a humongous hairball of “connections” that don’t connect. So please consider “a plot to involve the entire world” a shorthand for that.

              * * *

              As for violence advocacy, the Google definition of violence, probably the definitinon seen and used by the greatest number of humans in the world, treats property destruction (“vandalism”) as a subset of violence. Most people who have experienced property destruction in riots or war consider it violence. People in Oakland who experienced Black Bloc property destruction consider it violence. People who have experienced Black Bloc property destruction since its origins in Germany in the 80s consider that destruction violence.

              The reader is asked to consider how they would act if somebody came into their home, destroyed all the furniture, smashed the electronics, threw the books on the street, set them on fire, then ripped all the copper piping out of the walls, cut down the trees, and uprooted all the plants in the garden. And then came back and pissed all over the floors. All without any bodily injury at all. I submit that most would consider that property destruction an act of violence. It would certainly be considered a case of domestic violence in the case of marital conflict, and worthy of a restraining order!

              It is true that there are factions within Occupy that (contrary to OWS’s declaration) do not accept the idea of private property. It is also true that there are flavors in the Black Bloc that like to smash things up. These factions — granted, it’s hard to connect the two, because the factions that like to smash things up have a long tradition of wearing, for reasons that perhaps the conspiracy theorist I am not could work out, masks — claim that vandalism is not a subset of violence because that form of violence is something that they want to do without being called on it. Their protestations are mere Jesuitical hairsplitting, rationalizations from those who are dishing it out, instead of taking it. (In good 1% fashion, I might add.)

              The putative bright line between vandalism and violence is, in other words, a rhetorical stance. There’s no particular reason anyone who wishes Occupy to succeed must adopt that stance, let alone the carefully crafted and Orwellian “diversity of tactics” bushwa — a phrase that’s about as honest as serving meat to a vegetarian and calling it diversity of foodstuffs. I don’t see why violence advocates can’t have the courage of their convictions, but then, I’m not advocating what they advocate, so I don’t have their problem.

          5. Walter Wit Man

            And not to get derailed . . .

            There is clear evidence the video images that day were fabricated.

            How else do you explain the “nose out” video on Fox, and the fact they tried to cover over the mistake and then tried to erase the video from the record? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b9LURV-joLI

            How else do you explain the editing beeps heard on all the stations about 17 seconds before impact?

            What about the black outs right before impact? How often does live video feed black out? The excuses aren’t credible.

    1. Walter Wit Man

      You won’t believe this. The twin towers appear to have been mostly hollow. As in concrete was not poured. The people at let’s roll forums have been all over this.

      This false flag attack may have been planned from the very beginning.

      Here’s one of the many pertinent links on the subject at let’s roll forums: http://letsrollforums.com/press-release-world-trade-t24256.html

      Basically, the people on this forum (as well as other places like the September Clues forums) did FOAI requests on the towers and found out that they were mostly not leased until around 1999.

      Also, they have discovered precisely what you said, that they were shoddily built; the upper floors were hollow! Check it out.

      1. different clue

        If the twin towers were indeed built shoddily by the standards of the time, that in itself need not be a sign that an attack was anticipated; let alone planned for.

        That could indeed be just a sign of mafia quality work for mafia family profit . . . just as the commenter I once ran across said.

        And the issue of who/what/why the attacks could be entirely unrelated to mafia quality construction to begin with . . . and would be well worth pursuing in its own terms.

        1. Walter Wit Man

          It goes well beyond shoddy.

          They were “hollow” in a number of ways. First, the towers don’t appear to have been filled with tenants as was alleged. Many of the companies that leased the building had fake employees that died in the attacks (this is a whole other massive area of “research” where it can really get interesting following leads and seeing how fake personas were created).

          Second, it appears many of the floors were never meant to be occupied or even have desks or whatnot sit on them.

          Here’s an interesting discussion on the possibility no concrete was used in a lot of the building:


          The lights at night also gave it the appearance of being occupied and at some point they appear to have put in a shutter system to hide the lack of occupancy.

          1. JamesW

            Outstanding points, WWM, sir!

            “Many of the companies that leased the building had fake employees that died in the attacks …”

            Remember that “dead peasants insurance” scam awhile back (I think it was WSJ reporter, Ellen Schultz, who first broke it)? Bunch of insurance policies claimed by companies against their employees that day….scams within scams within scams….

            Plus, EurekaGGN had been supposedly laying fiber optic cable several days prior in the top floors of both towers, and had the contract for the entire WTC — wonder what that would have cost??????

          2. Lambert Strether

            @WWM Please add the fake tenants — and presumbly their fake answering machines, fake FedEx accounts, fake mail drops, etc. — to the project budget requested above.

            Seriously. This is (predominantly a finance blog, after all). So why not put some line items together and come up with a dollar figure?

            UPDATE Fixed typo.

        2. LeonovaBalletRusse

          dc, the infrastructure of the Twin Towers was strategically wired to cause the Towers I, II, and VII to “fall into their own footprints” on a date/time certain.

          It may be worse than you imagine, but with the Bush Dynasty at the heart of every occult matter in the U.S., any crime is possible. See at http://www.youtube.com

          “Do You Believe in Magick (4o6)” – also 1-6 for complete picture.

      2. LeonovaBalletRusse

        WWM, “may have been planned?” Bet on it. Now discover the GOLD that was moved out of the basement.

    2. LeonovaBalletRusse

      dc, get a clue: a member of the Bush Dynasty was in charge of Security for the Twin Towers in plenty of time to be CERTAIN that the set up would permit his brother the Decider to bring the coup d’etat with his Official authority as President and Commander in Chief (even though Cheney was his boss).

      This was an arch conspiracy of insiders to end Constitutional Law and bring the coup d’etat for the benefit of the insiders. BUST them.

    3. nonclassical

      I have seen pictures of metal beams after towers fell, appearing to show chemical cut beams…not bent as one would conceive..again, no forensics were allowed…and wreckage gotten rid of ASAP..meanwhile, families of 911 victims
      who were in buildings lobbied for forensics, to no avail…

  7. Lambert Strether

    We need a Truth Commission for everything it seems.

    I’ve said for a long time that Washington was a sack of pus waiting to burst. Perhaps that time has finally come….

    UPDATE The story GW cites has oddly, or not, completely fallen off the online version’s front page.

  8. Maju

    I am under the impression that the Saudis were not involved, the Israelis were instead. However it could be both (it seems we all acknowledge now that the US government, military and secret services were behind it, right?)

    Why not the Saudis? “Qui bono?”, to whom it benefits?

    The immediate result of 9/11 was increased US intervention against Saudi allies: first of all Afghanistan (and even Pakistan) and later Iraq. The Saudis got no benefits but increased trouble from the attacks. Hussein’s Iraq was whatever but it was a Sunni Arab state per the regime, even if secularist. Now Iraq a puppet of Teheran… while Afghanistan and Pakistan, then close friends of Riyadh are collapsing into chaos.

    But Pakistan’s nuclear bomb and Iraq’s pan-Arab ambitions were a potential threat to Israel, whose rivalry with Iran is more apparent (for show) than real.

    Also it’s doubtful that Saudi Arabia gained anything with increased US military presence in the area, while Israel obviously does. This, according to Petras, was the main reason why the USA induced the invasion of Kuwait in the 90s: to gain greater military presence in the Persian Gulf. Similarly the 9/11 attacks were a continuity of this imperialist strategy, favoring greater US-presence at the expense of Saudi-promoted Sunni Fundamentalist regimes such as the Taliban dictatorship in Afghanistan or the military regime in Pakistan.

    I strongly dislike the Saudi islamo-fascist regime but they are not calling the shoots here: they are actually more dancing at the rhythm set by Tel Aviv and the Pentagon.

    1. psychohistorian

      How about considering that the world is run by a cartel of global inherited rich that are playing the nations of our world like chess pieces in their sick game.

    2. LeonovaBalletRusse

      Maju, CUI BONO? The 1% Global Reich and its .99% Global Agents–at the “national” and other “local” levels–are the ones who benefit from such destruction all over the globe, leaving the 99% to take the losses and pay the bills.

      It’s for 1% Global Reich Lebensraum by any name “without firing a shot” and their Lebensraum by “Endless War” for profits to the .01% and their .99% Agents.

      The Mobster Modus Operandi is illustrated vividly in “Confessions of an Economic Hit Man” by Perkins (find him also on YouTube).

      1. rjlaures

        I recently read “War is a Racket” by General Smedley Butler where he said that the main reason for war is profit. In the preface of the copy of that book the story is told of how fascist elements in this country attemted to recurit him to take out FDR. It seems to me that John Perkins is just a continuation of what has been going on for a long time. Remember there was Prescott Bush before the Georges.

    1. LeonovaBalletRusse

      PP, you Ridiculous Troll: Agent for the .01% Reich: “Hit the road, Jack, and don’t come back.”

    2. Jack M.Hoff

      Ha Ha Philip you arsshole, Now i see why you admire kid dynamite so much. You two clocksuckers are playing the exact same game. frickin liars. I never did beleive much of what you write, as it doesn’t add up. Who in the hell do you really work for?

  9. Max424

    I wrote this one year ago.

    “In my opinion, the most powerful revelation to come out of the WikiLeaks releases so far is the fact that the Saudi’s desperately want to attack Iran. I knew the House of Saud was OK Israeli flyovers, and targeted US mini-strikes, but I didn’t realize the Kingdom truly desires all out war with Iran — and the sooner the better.

    Why? Well, it might be the old Sunni/Shia thing, or the old Arab/Persian thing, or it could be just for basic Mid-East dominance, etc., but; the Saudi’s have to know that Iran will attack them in kind. Why would they want that?

    If attacked, Iran will launch thousands of missiles, of all different varieties, and they will utterly destroy the Saudi’s only two offshore transfer facilities in the Persian Gulf –the export terminals at Ras Tanura and Al Juaymah, through which 95% of the Kingdom’s petroleum exports pass,

    They will also severely or irreparably damage the crude oil processing plant at Abqaiq, which handles 70% of the Saudi Arabia’s oil production.

    That’s just for starters. Iranian missiles and whole array of other weapons systems — including sabotage teams — will wreak havoc on the rest of the Kingdom’s petroleum infrastructure, including the defenseless latticework of oil pipelines that lines the Gulf itself .

    Meanwhile, Iranian surface to surface missiles, many outfitted with 2,000 pound warheads, could well sink every supertanker uploading, offloading or just plain sailing around in Persian Gulf. Talk about the Mother of All Oil Spills.

    At that point, Saudi Arabia would no longer be a petroleum exporting nation. For how long? Quite possibly, for many, many years.


    Interesting indeed.

    My theory; the Family Saud wants out; they no longer want to be the “swing producer of last resort,” and they’re willing to gamble.

    The Family knows, at “swing” pace, they will not exporting for long. The know this because their once mega-producing supergiant field, Gahwar, is already 40% water cut, and, perhaps more importantly, because homeland consumption of oil is rapidly doubling –as in, every seven years.

    The Family realizes they have perhaps 10 years left as a major exporter; after that, they will consuming almost every drop they produce. If they allow themselves to get blown up now, and they can miraculously hold on to power, they can then push into the middle distance, that inevitable day of reckoning.

    At the same time, the Americans have lost all trust for The Family. They’ve been dealing with the Chinese. The Russians. They’re hold on power is shaky. They’re liars. They’re cocky. They’re Muslims. They’ve spent billions exporting extremist Wahhabism to all points of the globe. They want to get attacked!

    What’s up with that?

    We, on the other hand, can’t attack Iran, not really, not without using nukes. We simply can’t get root out enough of their missile systems, with our conventional shit, not to suffer extreme and irrational economic pain, at our end.

    So why do we want to attack them –on behalf of the ingrate Saudi’s, the ungrateful Israeli’s, and our own insanely stupid Right Wing? What good will it do in the end, other than to cripple our economy by bringing us $500/barrel oil?

    Wouldn’t it be better, easier, and infinitely less dangerous, to just take over the real problem –and by way of bonus, take over the place that still has the largest and most accessible, petroleum reserve?

      1. nonclassical


        as George HW stated HE would NOT “destabilize” the entire middle-east by deposing-killing Saddam, “project for a new american century” neocons KNEW
        they WERE destabilizing entire middle-east…for PROFIT$$$$….

        Shock Doctrine-rise of disaster capitalism…not to mention competition with China for resources..

  10. LAS

    While we are discussing suspicions about a Saudi connection, I’d like to mention my suspicion that the anthrax threat in the weeks after 911 probably was a CIA or Army test on the US population. Both CIA and Army have conducted unethical experiments on urban US populations in the past and the anthrax exposure fits their past unethical experimental approach. No one likes to pursue this either.

    1. LeonovaBalletRusse

      LAS, yes, this has been pursued, but not by official “authorities.” Wonder why.

  11. Michael Fiorillo

    First, can we separate possible Saudi involvement with the 9/11 attacks from the claim that the buildings were intentionally demolished by an evil National Security State cabal? One does not follow from the other.

    Also, the Mob connection to the buildings’ collapse is ridiculous. Sure, wiseguys are involved in the construction industry; they make sure to get their skim, whether its from the GC, the subcontractors or the unions. But the Mob doesn’t design buildings, engineer them or provide the specifications for the materials that compose them.

    The Twin Towers collapse was inherent in the way they were designed and constructed. They were essentially tubes, with each concrete floor held up by a latticework of thin steel trusses, inadequately fireproofed and vulnerable to the heat of burning jet fuel and the plastics that make up the modern office. 9/11 Truthers frequently harp on the claim that jet fuel and plastic don’t burn hot enough to melt steel. So what? they don’t have to; they just need to weaken it enough to expand and then sag.

    As for Building #7, all the talk about it is a red herring. I have a good friend who is a contractor, who happened to lose two of his employees in the north tower that day. Months after the attacks, he met the building engineer from WTC #7, who was on the roof of the building when Tower #2 was struck, and was blown back by the force of the explosion. He suffered a broken collarbone and broken ribs, and barely made it out alive. He told my friend that #7 had received a fuel delivery the day before, that the fuel lines had been cut as a result of debris falling from Tower #1, and that the same physical forces were at work as in the two larger towers.

    Below are links to three articles from Counterpunch – not customarily thought of as medium for National Security State propaganda – that do an effective job of demolishing the fever dreams of 9/11 Truthers. The first two deal with the physics and thermodynamics of the event, and are written by physicist Manuel Garcia. The third article gives the political context of the Truther movement, and is written by Alexander Cockburn.


    1. Ted

      “The fuel tanks were full”
      And they were on the roof of the building. Please look at the Building 7 page on architects and engineers for 9/11 truth and explain how the office furniture fires off to one side on a couple of floors that had burned out caused the entire structure to miraculously collapse into its own footprint.


    2. Jim3981

      I won’t try and debate 911 WTC7 demolition with you. This has been done hundreds of times elsewhere with people more informed than me on the topic.

      I will say I have designed steel frames and various hardware for semiconductor furnaces which operate at temperatures of 2200 degres F.

      I’ve looked at the AE911truth site and the evidence of WTC 7 collapsing. I find it extremely unlikely the building would collapsed like it did.

      Here is a good thread that discusses sock puppets and other internet propaganda. I talking about just the original thread post.


    3. LeonovaBalletRusse

      MF, Troll, Tell it to the troops. “Hit the road, Jack, and don’t come back.”

    4. Walter Wit Man

      See what I mean about the 9/11 truth stuff being interesting? I love seeing these comments. Whenever people start sniffing around, as is happening in this thread, well prepared perps show up, usually claiming to know victims, having technical expertise, appealing to emotion (“for the sake of the families of the victim, move along”), and generally have well prepared talking points.

      What, no reference to the Popular Mechanics article supporting the NIST report?

      And the counterpunch article is another favorite “debunking’ source–but it’s provable false. I won’t get into it because it seems totally confirmed that building 7 did not come down b/c of fire. What, did all the major support happen to bend and buckle because of fire all at the same time? A rank amateur is able to tell that a natural collapse would result in a much more asymmetric fall. Surely the building would list to one side, or only partially collapse, if there were different fires in different locations in the building.

      Also, what company did your friend work for? What floor where these “victims” on?

      C’mon. Prove us wrong. Let’s confirm your bona fides.

    5. LeonovaBalletRusse

      MF, sone do know that Counterpunch is an organ of the Ministry of Truth. Just STOP it. Buss off.

    6. nonclassical

      first, there were other buildings between 7 and towers…second, there were 5 excuses why 7 came down…I quit listening and started exploring after 2. Third, damages to 7 were on opposite side from towers.

      First excuse-shock waves from towers
      Second excuse-parts of towers hit 7 (video shows it didn’t)
      third excuse-fires started in basement, weakening
      fourth excuse-fires began in middle of 7
      fifth excuse-tanks on top of 7.

      7 dropped many hours after towers
      records covering towers-work done, so much more, inside towers.
      audio appears to discuss 7 “pulled”

      1. Lambert Strether

        Ya know, if readers were going to perform a financial transaction based on this comment, they’d be looking for backup in the form of linky goodness as part of their due diligence. Just saying.

  12. john personna

    Sometimes the rational thing is to have a policy that is purely forward-looking. There may be some “feel good” in a policy that looks back and “gets even” while breaking your own future, but that is not statesmanship.

    1. nonclassical

      without transparency, oversight, accountability, things degenerate further…
      without, we have no basis for law..

      entire basis of U.S. society is private property-destroyed by “investment banks”-
      securitization of mortgages, etc..well documented by Yves. Entire basis of private property is LAW..

  13. Jill

    So many lies. The wikileaks e-mails are showing the complete interconnection between multiple nation’s “intelligence” agencies and private corporations. The official story has a lot of missing pieces, the S.A. connection is very important.

    After all the US govt. began not only one false war using 9/11 as the justification, but two. The Taliban offered to hand over OBL to a neutral court for trial. Instead, the US govt. choose to invade Afghanistan. If people knew about the Saudi connection might not our population have wondered why we didn’t attack that nation?

    One of the most interesting parts of the 9/11 story to me is the fact that David Addington and Dick Cheney were, at about 1 p.m.,in the basement of the WH discussing the creation of Gitmo. That’s a pretty weird thing to discuss only a few hours into a terrorist attack.

    1. LeonovaBalletRusse

      Jill, connect that with info about George H.W. Bush Carlyle connection with Saudi Oil pimp at a certain hotel on the morning of 911. Connect with “911 hijackers” hole up in Florida, whose Governor at the time was Jeb Bush.

      It’s time to BUST the Bush Dynasty: Agents of a Foreign Power. File “The Tyrannicide Brief” against George Herbert Walker Bush, George Walker Bush, Dick Cheney, Henry Kissinger–Traitors while in the “Unitary” Executive Branch, which includes those under “Consultant” Cloak of Invisibility.

    2. JamesW

      Well stated, Jill, well stated, and those Wikileaked cables are a treasure trove and the closest thing to a free press in America in many, many years.

      1. Walter Wit Man

        I actually think they are clever disinformation.

        It’s suspicious once you start looking into the details.

        It doesn’t hurt to question your assumptions in any case.

        But maybe I’ll save that conspiracy for another day though.

    3. nonclassical


      People knew…I personally asked Washington State Senator Patty Murray about
      this-she replied over 95% of her phone calls, e-mails, etc, were against allowing
      bushitters war powers…I asked WHY bushitters were allowed…she replied, first,
      government officials were LIED TO by bushitters…second, IF they were lying, THEY should-would be culpable…if they were correct, representatives feared for their own jobs. Check out McCarthyism…it has been ever thus-this time there were no courageous individuals-“Good Night and Good Luck”…

  14. nice pipeline ya got there

    The Saudi state might have immunity,


    but the question is whether some smokin’ drinkin’ whorin’ Princelings need to get extraordinarily rendered to the Hague for crimes of concern to the international community under the procedures of Rome Statute Article 13b.

    It would be priceless to see the United States government veto a Security Council resolution to get to the bottom of the 9/11 terror attack.

    1. nonclassical

      nice pipeline-

      very interesting-succinct…we’d all love to see bushitters in docket-Hague…

  15. Jack Hepler

    Thank you Michael Fiorello for your cogent comments. I looked long into the truther views and came up with the same conclusion.
    One point: unlike the JFK assassination, there have been NO confessions of guilty conscience, even anonymously. And it would have taken a helluva team to set up a demolition even if they did have some magickal space-age thermite. So we must give the 911 truthers some credit that they have not tried to make up such a confessional.
    Another point: the Bush/Cheney gang just did not have the balls or the brains to set up something like this. And the Mossad? a lot of darker skinned, heavy-accented fellows hanging around before 911 would have damn well been noticed.

    So lets leave this until some real evidence is found not just “questions” and alleged anomalies.
    The larger catastrophes– two horrific wars, environmental toxication and the great Wall Street larceny– happen right in front of us.

    1. Jill

      Jack Helper,

      Many LEO’s have testified that they informed the administration of leads which were then dead stopped at the WH. That’s not speculation.

      After chastising people for “speculating” you then offer your own speculating (with a chaser of racism), saying: “another point: the Bush/Cheney gang just did not have the balls or the brains to set up something like this. And the Mossad? a lot of darker skinned, heavy-accented fellows hanging around before 911 would have damn well been noticed.”

      I was curious as to why your speculation is acceptable? I am also curious why you call actual information, “speculation”.

      This story concerns sworn testimony about evidence the American public was not allowed to know. That evidence connects some people in Saudi Arabia to the attacks of 9/11. This American citizen would like this secret evidence made public.

    2. Ted

      So what are you GS-11? or GS-12?

      The Architects and Engineers site has plenty of evidence of the thermite.

      The buildings were being rewired. And fireproofed on the same exact floors the planes hit that just happened to be empty and the the whole complex was protected by George Bush’s Brother’s security company. You’re a coincidence
      theorist right? A conspiracy denier?

      Thousands of German spies were in England looking for evidence of where the Allies were going to invade Europe.
      The U.S. and the Allies managed to keep that a succesful secret through compartmentalization.

      1. alex

        “Thousands of German spies were in England looking for evidence of where the Allies were going to invade Europe.”

        No they weren’t. At the beginning of the war the British rounded up the German spies (who they’d been tracking for years beforehand) and they were either imprisoned or executed, or turned to feed false information to Germany.

        German espionage was notoriously bad and British counter-espionage was very good.

        P.S. The above is not a comment on 9/11, just a WWII history correction.

          1. Up the Ante

            Allen Dulles, the Great Anticipator of the Occupy movement ?

            For only Allen and his ‘heirs’ possess the True American Values ?

      2. Walter Wit Man

        This is why the revelation that no one may have died that day is so huge. Think of how much easier it is to recruit people into a conspiracy if they know no one will die. They were probably told they weren’t even really committing any crimes that day, or if they were they were minor.

        Furthermore, information was likely compartmentalized.

        Also, some of the perps probably didn’t know they were perps. For instance, the military was engaging in a huge amount of exercises that day so there was a lot of confusion. I bet that a cover story was invented for those in the military (as well as air traffic control people, etc.) so they would not ask questions. And I bet that cover is that the military shot down a civilian plane over PA.

        Think about it. If you tell the military people they did a hard job the American people couldn’t accept they are likely to feel proud and to stop asking questions because they feel they have secret information.

        1. JamesW

          Also, some of the perps probably didn’t know they were perps.

          You’re working too hard, man! People in Australia, Denmark, etc., gleaned on to this way before us Americans: look into the backgrounds of many of those passengers aboard the four airplanes that day. It was a highly compartmentalized op, and dead people tell no tales, my friend!

          If you’ve ever been in the military and involved with a large-scale operation, you would know it actually only takes a few people to fully understand the entire op!

          1. Walter Wit Man

            I have looked very closely into the backgrounds of the people on those planes. I agree with you they are very suspicious because of their corporate and military ties and because of how empty the planes were and the many other details surrounding the flights.

            Have you checked out the research about many of these people appearing to be fake? Or many of them could have gotten new identities from 9/11.

            So I agree with you in particular about the remote control airplane technology unit being an odd fact. But I think that is likely a false lead. (btw, have you looked into Egypt Air 990 and SilkAir 185? It’s possible that technology was used in those crashes. But I think these first crashes may have been a test run. Or something.

            But I disagree with you that killing these people off is the easiest thing to do. Quite the opposite in fact. By killing them you have angry family members that go to trial instead of quietly “settling” lawsuits. Fake victims or people getting new identities are not going to talk.

            And the military members likely have a reason to keep a bunch of stuff secret b/c they were probably told the military shot down one of the planes that day but it’s secret b/c the American people can’t handle the truth. So the military people won’t sniff around too much and won’t talk about their unusual actions that day. There were mock hijackings going on that day so if a military member called someone and pretended to be a hijacked passenger or if they helped unload a plane in Ohio or something, they will probably remain silent and told the reason is to protect America from the hard truth.

            Furthermore, the logistics of flying planes into the buildings doesn’t make sense. These pilots were not capable and the plane was exceeding it’s capacity. Plus, it’s too risky. Too much chance of pilot error.

            I will agree that it is possible a gas was released incapacitating everyone on the plane and then remote controlled into the building, or something.

            But the main argument against, which I don’t know why I waited until now, is the obvious video fakery of the images. The live shots of the second tower hit are fake. Clearly.

          2. Walter Wit Man

            Oh, and who would love the opportunity to get new identities for their employees so they can use them for their needs in the shadowy game this elite is playing?

            Military contractors.

            And who was on those planes you say?

          3. nonclassical

            ..entire neocon “project for a new american century” war criminals was a small cabal-close relative with grade 1 Pentagon clearance-military-industrial complex states noone in MIA could believe these perps got control of U.S. military…

            LIED their way into power, LIED about how they used power, LIED their way out
            of power…(surge my butt-kick the can down the road)

    1. LeonovaBalletRusse

      jp, “oh yeah” – a critical mass of these photos makes an impression. No “disinterested” parties here.

  16. LeonovaBalletRusse

    Actually, in the video clip is that Mica Brzezinsky getting revenge against Dear Old Daddy (“Who’s your Daddy?”) for the pederasts Daddy brought home for his little girl’s “education sentimentale” – not to mention whatever he got out of it?

  17. Susan the other

    Bob Kerrey did an interesting about face. He was gearing up to run for president against little Bush when he seems to have been blackmailed. Something about his Vietnam service. He quickly backed off and was given a post at Columbia (?) and then put on the 9/11 Commission.

      1. steel man


        if the buildings were hollow, they would be LESS likely to fall. The fact is that each was held upright by a central steel column – composed of many thousands of steel beams – look for videos of the WTC buildings construction.

        There would be no way to build the central columns even if one beam was missing, they were build very prominently ahead of the the actual floors attached on them. On the other hand, with less concrete, the columns would have had less weight to carry, so collapse would be less likely.

        All this kind of makes the “hollow” theory, well, hollow.

        1. Walter Wit Man

          I’m not following you steel man.

          Under my theory the buildings were intentionally demolished using thermite or whatever.

          There was never a plane that hit the buildings. There may have been a missile or a Global Hawk drone that hit it, but I believe it probably was simply a napalm explosion (simply look at the pictures of the explosion when the second plane hit and compare to pictures from Vietnam of napalm runs–I’m assuming the almost 500 ft. explosion is real and the plane is not). There were probably also localized charges to make the airplane holes (you can see it happening on the Naudet footage of the first plane hitting). Later, the buildings were pulled with thermite and demolished. There may have been some sort of effect, either physical powder, or cgi, or both, to enhance the dust effect.

          By “hollow” I mean in part that concrete was not poured on most floors and pans were missing from others. Look at the rubble. It was a small rubble pile with no trusses to be found. There was hardly any concrete or rebar. That’s one sense that they were “hollow” . The other is that there were no real tenants (hardly any). There are pictures when the top floors are supposedly leased where you can look through the buildings in front of a rising sun and they are empty. They later put a shutter system on the windows and the lights were always on giving the impression of filled towers.

          Check out my link above re the concrete challenge–where they are trying to compile evidence of all the concrete pours that would have to have occurred . . .

  18. jsmith

    For those who would like help, one of the money quotes on the FBI “Dancing Israeli” report is on page 87:


    “However, he[Mossad agent] is clearly visible in the photographs (enclosed) which he and other occupants of the van had taken from a roof top parking garage located at 100 Manhattan Avenue, Jersey City, New Jersey, within minutes after the first WTC building was struck by an aircraft.”

    1. JamesW

      Perhaps far more telling was that falsified TV clip of celebrating Palestinians which, it later came to light, was planeted by the Israeli government, and pertained to a much earlier release of Palestinian prisoners and had nothing to do with 9/11!

      1. Walter Wit Man

        Yeah, and the reality was it was Israelis that were cheering after the first tower was struck.

        Propaganda 101 I guess. Accuse your enemies of your own behavior.

        It’s pretty brazen though.

        How many Americans associate Palestinians with people that cheer terrorist attacks against America? It worked.

        1. anon

          I remember Alan Hart’s speculation that those Israelis were celebrating the hit, which was their planning and execution, calling those planes on targets via remote control, not celebration on the deaths of the people in the towers as the Palestinians were depicted by the US/UK MSM at the time.

  19. RSDallas

    “There are just some things that you don’t want to know?” This statement, in and of itself typifies our current leaders in Washington on both sides of the isle. It continues to taer America apart. Wake up America!

  20. Hugh

    I am not a conspiracy theorist, at least not in the regular sense. Our elites have never been especially open or honest with we of the hoi polloi. This has become only more extreme as our country has descended into kleptocracy. Kleptocracy can only function under a cover of lies.

    So when some great disaster comes along like 9/11 or the 2008 meltdown, our elites lie to us. And although we know they are lying to us, we can’t say definitively how they are. This naturally enough gives rise to a myriad of conspiracy theories. The number and tenor of these actually help our elites because their lies get lost among them.

    So I have no idea what exactly happened on 9/11. Now that I have come to an understanding of kleptocracy, I know that it wasn’t just isolated, specific failures among our elites, but rather a more general, systemic failure that was ultimately to blame for this tragedy. And I know too that both Saudi Arabia and Pakistan, without necessarily being directly involved, contributed heavily to the events and people that led up to 9/11.

    I would say too that we need to look back to just after the Second World War. The US had a foreign policy that we all know about that was defined by the Cold War. But it also had one that didn’t get talked about much which was based on oil.

    Our oil-centric foreign policy has been greatly complicated by our relations with Israel and there is great grist there for conspiracies about whether this was a feature or a bug. For me, this policy has had two distinct phases divided by the oil embargo and fall of the shah in the 1970s. Since these events, I would say that American involvement in the Middle East became more direct and militarized. US policy throughout has been to use our presence in the Middle East to stabilize the region and protect the flow of oil, but, in fact, this presence has been the greatest external factor destabilizing the area. Again this contradiction is fertile ground for conspiracies.

    And this brings us around again to 9/11 and how we are to parse some 55 years of US meddling in the Middle East, and its oil, with regard to it.

    1. Walter Wit Man

      But don’t you think that understanding kleptocracy requires you to grapple with the specifics in the 9/11 attacks rather than saying you are not a conspiracy theorist on one hand but on the other hand something fishy was going on?

      My question above is an attempt to narrow the focus to the logical possibilities in this particular case. Isn’t this a really important thing to do? Why do you abstain?

      We know enough to come to certain conclusions. Why avoid them? Don’t we have a responsibility to name those conclusions, even if they are uncomfortable?

      Under what theory would the Saudis attack and how? It doesn’t seem probable. Shouldn’t one try to answer that question if the only other alternative is that 9/11 was an “inside job?”

      And btw, the official 9/11 story is a conspiracy theory. The question is what conspiracy was correct.

      1. Hugh

        The Saudi regime is out for itself. So on the one hand, it had no interest in attacking the US. On the other, it had no problem relieving internal pressures on the monarchy by allowing groups in the country to export their radicalism elsewhere leading to attacks on the US.

        Similarly, you can see the US attempt to move bases in Saudi Arabia to Iraq via the invasion as exporting instability to a neighboring country. This of course did not keep the KSA from being critical of American moves to replace the Sunni power structure in Iraq with the majority Shias, but overall it was far better than keeping American bases in their country, even if they were way out in the desert.

        Again this plays out in a multitude of ways. Something like half of the suicide bombers in Iraq were Saudis. From the Saudi regime’s point of view, better they should blow themselves up in Iraq killing Americans and Iraqis, preferably Shia, than causing problems at home.

        It is a convenient lie that both the Saudi regime and our kleptocrats accept that the Saudis are our allies. They are not. They simply have a lot of oil which they need us to protect from other countries and their own population, and as long as we do, on their terms, they are willing to play along with the “ally” cr*p.

    2. JamesW

      So I have no idea what exactly happened on 9/11.

      And I have no doubt planted troll, that you can’t do arithmetic, have diffulty with programming, aren’t sure what constitutes the internal combustion engine, have never served in any branch of the US military, have no idea what the ATCC system is, have never bothered to look at the FOIA-released black box data on 9/11 aircraft (two, I believe, so far, thanks to Pilots/911, etc.), have no idea what was actually in the two towers and Building 7, etc., etc., ad nauseum, ad infititum…..but especially are incapable of following the money, even if you weren’t on somebody’s payroll, always saying the exact same drivel, year after year after tired year, son.

      Buzz off, Hughey the planted troll….

      1. Walter Wit Man

        It’s not absurd. I enjoy Hugh’s opinions and his comments so I make no representations about him and assume the best about him . . .

        but to people who have been debating these issues for a while there is a reason to be wary of gatekeepers. Gatekeeping in comments is a primary MO of the perps. They’ve also hired actors and have people post and do all sorts of things. They have done everything they can to shut the conversation down and call those who question “crazy conspiracy theorists.” A year ago I would have thought the above accusation was crazy, but now I recognize gatekeeping as being a common problem. Our media and lots of our internet is controlled by the perps.

        I’m positive there is at least one perp on this thread in fact.

        But hey, it just makes it more of a challenge. The accusation is probably off the mark here. But it’s probably healthy and rational to be dubious of people that want to prevent the most critical lines of inquiry or won’t draw the logical conclusions stemming from their intelligent observations.

        Frankly the recent “non violence” advocacy and the actions of people like Chris Hedges is another trigger issue for me. Same thing with some of the Ron Paul bashing. It seems motivated by ulterior motives and prevents a really significant opposition to the status quo. [hint–it’s not about these two groups per se, Paul and black bloc, but rather the threat they represent–the perps want to nip any resistance in the bud so these 3 issues are high priorities]

        Of course there are many people who are acting in good faith but are simply wrong on these issues. :) So to those of us who think this evidence is so compelling it is odd when smart people we otherwise agree with take what seems to be an idiosyncratic position on something really important! Like whether our government is engaging is massive false flag attacks and controls our media.

        So maybe some of us are so impressed with our own reasoning we are not giving the benefit of the doubt to other people . . .

        But there are perps running interference and these are the precise subjects that the perps are concerned with.

        1. Lambert Strether

          There are commenters who’ve been around the blogosphere a long time. Their styles are known, and their contributions are known. They clearly are not “planted trolls,” and IMNSHO the word “trolls” is being thrown around a little too freely.

    3. nonclassical


      All this and much, much more, documented in William Blum’s CIA expose’ reAL,
      “Killing Hope”….over 200 pages references…

    4. LeonovaBalletRusse

      Hugh, the parallel begins before WWI, as the Old Order was collapsing, while all three of Victoria’s grandsons ruled Britannia, Prussia/Holy Roman Reich II, and Russia, and the Berlin-Baghdad was being built, Germany was cool with the Ottoman Empire. The War for Black Gold was on, and the Anglo-American NEXUS dreaded displacement by German military power. The “British Empire” enlisted Lawrence to raise the Arabs against the Turks, and then the “British” plan for “Zion” on the ground as a wedge the City could count on came into play. The rest is history. It’s all about the oil and the money, money, money.

  21. Lambert Strether

    As for why now, this lawsuit might provide a clue. I’m having a hard time seeing Kerrey and Graham as whistleblowers, though at least Graham had the stones to write up his views of 9/11 in a novel.

    I guess I think that stuff like 9/11 and the events surrounding it are a lot more like a rugby scrum than a Swiss Watch, if you see what I mean. Does it never occur to anyone that there may not be a “truth” that is discoverable? That all we will ever have is partial disclosures? Rather like reconstructing MBSs, I suppose…

    Not to say that we must not strive for the truth, we always should, but “reality is more cunning than any theory.”

    1. Walter Wit Man

      Ah. Good clue indeed. I forgot about that.

      Actually, this clue fits into my theory well. This is part of a coordinated attempt to shift the blame from Al Qaeda to Saudi Arabia.

      The litigation component of this plan is perfect because it’s an excuse to slow walk these revelations over the next few years. It’s also an excuse to reveal these issues.

    2. Walter Wit Man

      From the Complaint:

      Internal al Qaeda documents chronicling the formation of the organization, seized during a 2002 raid of the Sarajevo office of an al Qaeda front, the Benevolence International
      Foundation (“BIF”), confirm that al Qaeda planned from its inception to use the MWL and its subsidiary bodies, to include the IIRO, to provide support and cover for al Qaeda’s operations.

      A BIF computer file named “Tareekh Osama”(or “Osama’s History”) contained numerous documents regarding al Qaeda’s formation and the participation of purported Islamic charities in al Qaeda’s support infrastructure, including the MWL and IIRO. For instance, the files include a
      document on MWL/IIRO letterhead stating that attacks would be launched from MWL offices:

      “And if he is being subjected to any pressures, let it be a secret (agreement), in a way that [Muslim World] League offices will be opened as(illegible) for the Pakistanis, and the attacks will be launched from the (these offices) …”).

      Aha. So we once again have a major document dump in one fell swoop, as we allegedly saw with the Wikileaks U.S. diplomatic cables, or the documents released this week.

      This is the cover story being laid. That’s a pretty convenient file to stumble across.

      1. nonclassical

        ..see Adam Curtis’, “The Power of Nightmares” BBC expose’..then tell us about

  22. Lambert Strether

    I’ve always enjoyed Philip K. Dick, and this quote from Game Players of Titan seems especially a propos:

    “Yep,” Mary Anne said.

    “How many are in it?”

    “Oh, thousands,” Mary Anne—or rather the vug—said. Despite what he saw he knew it to be a vug. “Just thousands and thousands. All over the planet.”

    “But not everyone’s in on it,” Pete said. “Because you still have to hide from the authorities. I think I will tell Hawthorne.”

    Mary Anne laughed. …

    What I have to remember is that they’re not all in it. The detective E. B. Black isn’t in it and Doctor Philipson; he or it isn’t in it, either. I can get help from something, somewhere, sometime.

    “Right you are,” Mary Anne said,

    “Are you a telepath?” he said to her.

    “I very much certainly darn right am.”

    “But,” he said, “your mother said you weren’t.”

    “My mother lied to you.” …

    As he sat on the edge of the bed removing his clothes he found something, a match folder stuffed into his left shoe, beneath his instep. He set the shoe down, held the match folder under the lamp by the bed and examined it. Carol, beside him, had already gotten into bed and apparently had gone directly to sleep.

    On the match folder, in his own hand, penciled words: WE ARE ENTIRELY SURROUNDED BY BUGS RUGS VUGS …

    In a way, this thread could be connected, by somebody with more wattage and bandwidth than I have, to the “modeling” discussion going on over in the NC Academic Wing. In the same way that there are academic “taxonomies” and popular, tag-based “folksonomies” (often more useful), there would then be “models” and “folk models” (no doubt also more useful). But how to sort out “the truth” using either sort of model is not clear to me.

    “The Truth Shall Make You Fret,” as Willem de Worde did not say….

    1. Walter Wit Man

      Seems to me such a high level analysis connecting diverse subjects requires the focus of a book.

      The internet can be great but sometimes the information is disjointed.

  23. Waking Up

    Since 9/11, a concerted effort was made to marginalize anyone who dared question “official” explanations. War protestors were called “unpatriotic” and those who wanted the truth on important matters whether they be on the existence of WMD’s or the real story about what happened to the twin towers were mocked and called “conspiracy theorists”. Whether the ideas put forth turn out to be true or false, we need to have real investigations and DEMAND answers. If our current actions, whether in regards to killing Osama bin Laden or killing people with drone missiles in various countries are all based upon lies, this is going to come back to haunt all of us in a big way. For this reason, I think many will try to obfuscate the truth.

    Unless we ALL want to go down with the increasingly authoritarian, anti-democracy direction our government is moving towards, then we need to ask and discuss all of these issues…out loud…in the open. We need citizen engagement at all levels, local, state, and national. We can start with questions such as who benefits from the endless wars and what are the consequences for our future? Follow the money, it often points to the answers. But, we can’t forget that Power is an aphrodisiac for many and should also be assessed in any issue.

    In regards to the Saudi government, why after all the years of trying to ignore their involvement with 9/11 is this becoming an issue now? Is someone trying to threaten the Saudi government to back us on an oil related issue (or to continue covering up some other issue) by showing that the U.S. will turn on you in an instant? Is this propaganda to be used at a later date to explain gas prices? How does this relate to Iran and Israel? Have some journalists and congressional representatives with a conscience decided people need to ask more questions?

    1. JamesW

      Good points, and two more: recall that James Baker occupied an office in Bush’s (that’s George W.) White House after 9/11/01, to defend the Saudis from suits and legal actions brought against them by any and all Americans?

      Also, recall (not that it garnered any publicity in America) that fellow who filed all those FOIAs right after OBL was whacked? He was filing to find any (any single piece of paper) that showed a paper trail in the US military, DoD, State Deparment, etc., indicating orders or directives as to any activity to the disposition of Osama’s remains.

      Now anyone whose ever done military service, or civil service for that matter, knows there always exists some type of paper trail — ALWAYS ! ! ! !

      His FOIAs all came back blank — no paper trail of any sort?

    2. LeonovaBalletRusse

      WU, this is not sudden, it has been years in the making. Only a critical mass of information and interest has brought this to larger attention. It’s not going away. For this reason, the Power is likely trying to jump on the issues and soft-pedal official involvement of the highest perps through diversion, deflection, dilution, etc. They can’t just ignore it or cry: “tin foil hatters*/conspiracy nutters any more.

      1. Lambert Strether

        It’s not clear to me why some Saudi involvement in 9/11 wasn’t obvious from the beginning, given that Bush rushed them out of the country on a plane when literally every other plane was grounded.

        And that’s the seam that Graham/Kerrey ripped open.

        How one gets from that to hollow buildings, fake personas, empty planes, et cetera is not clear to me. There’s no question that some … let’s say “shadow goverment operation” (instead of conspiracy) was going on, but what’s the theory of the case? More than a little judicious pruning is needed.

  24. Accrued Disinterest

    The biggest single factor IMHO, that something fishy was amiss with the 9/11 investigation is how hard its existence was fought by the Bush Administration and that it was given a drop-dead date.

    Forget all the other shit, explain these facts truthfully.

    1. Lambert Strether

      I sure hope none of the complexity as artificial. Because artificial complexity masking something simple would be right out of the 1%’s playbook on, say, mortgage backed securities. I’d say, if anything, we need fewer clues. Which is perhaps what you meant.

      1. ebear

        Does it really matter? Nobody’s going to follow up on any of this. Tomorrow there’ll be five new topics on NC, the same people will be ranting and railing over those, and this one will be completely forgotten.

  25. different clue

    About those anthrax attacks, the first one as I remember was a successful anthrax murder against at least one person at the Florida newspaper which ran unflattering photos of one of Dubya Bush’s drunken daughters getting arrested for something. One wonders whether it was a Bush family revenge-murder for running those pictures?

    Someone above brought up the matter of the plane which hit the Pentagon hitting exactly the part of it where hundreds of civilian moneyologists and forensic fraudfinders were working on the Case of the Missing Trillions. Jeff Wells at Rigorous Intuition wrote a disturbing post about that.

    I remember reading about or hearing something else. Supposedly remains of an airplane engine were found in the Pentagon attack-site debris. Remains of “the” airplane engine, in fact. And it was an engine used not in the Big Boeings like the said-to-be-involved plane was . . . but an engine used in a rather smaller (but still big enough) kind of plane. And while many people recall seeing “a plane” hit the Pentagon, others report seeing “some kind of missile”. Perhaps the people who recall seeing “the missile” also recall seeing the plane but feel as if that part of it goes without saying so they didn’t mention the plane. A theory I’ve seen covering all that is that a smaller kind of jet plane was pre-painted to look exactly like the bigger Boeing so that is what people would recall seeing. And as it approached it fired a pre-mounted missile to open an “entry hole” into the Pentagon wall, which the plane itself flew into and enlarged. Have any groups been studying anything about supposedly recovered “engine remains” from the Pentagon attack site and comparing those engine remains with the types of planes which are supposed to use that sort of engine?

    So . . . is there even any strong evidence on whether such “jet engine remains” were actually found there? If not, then all this is “just a theory”. If yes, then we really need to peel back the tinfoil from around that engine and what it rules in and what it rules out.

    1. Michael Fiorillo

      Someone named Michael Fiorillo has been exposed as part of the “Coverupist Community,” but it goes much deeper than that.

      Fiorillo was seen on the Grassy Lawn on 11/22/63.
      Fiorillo eliminated The Babushka Woman.
      Fiorillo cast the Magic Bullet out of silver because he knew it was impervious to Federal Reserve-issued fiat currency.
      Fiorillo conspired with Charles Manson and the CIA to destroy the Counterculture.

      Fiorillo murdered Mae Brusselll.

      1. Michael Fiorillo

        The microelectronics in Fiorillo’s teeth caused him to press the “submit” button prematurely. It can now also be revealed that:

        Fiorillo helped George Bush and Dick Cheney bury the non-existent bodies of the non-existent people who didn’t fly into the Pentagon on the tarmac at Offutt Air Force Base on 9/11.

        Fiorillo oversaw the placing of thermite in the Towers that were not hit by jets filled with CIA beards.

        Fiorillo is an evil troll. Exposé him and his ilk you’ve achieved the Grand Unified Field Theory that explains it all. But beware, because this evil troll and vampire is standing between the People and the Truth that will set them free.

        1. different clue

          ooooOOOOoooo . . .

          TWO backtoback comments, Michael Fiorillo?

          Did I hit a nerrrrve, Michael Fiorillo?

  26. different clue

    By the way, I notice that someone named “Michael Fiorillo” up above referrences Alexander Cockburn of Counterpunch as being a trustworthy authority whose debunkage of “9/11 Truthers” should be taken seriously.

    Given the fact that Alexander Cockburn is a loud and proud Global Warming Denier ( on whose behalf I wonder . . . hmmmmm . . . ) I don’t know how believable he
    would be in his “debunking” of “9/11 Truthers”. Now . . . the pattern of his debunking could be an interesting clue as to what the Coverupist Community would like to divert us into believing and away from looking into, and why.

  27. Walter Wit Man

    That guy knew what he was talking about.

    Apart from any problems with the modernist design, it appears the towers were not even built to spec. Most of the floors were not poured with the 4″ of concrete called for and many floor pans were not even put in. See discussion below and link to forum where people are looking through all the photos and videos from construction and collapse and rubble and trying to figure out what happened.

    They are trying to find workers to get recollections, etc. But it doesn’t look like concrete was poured and there there was no office equipment, etc. in most of the building.

    The lack of concrete could actually have made the building stronger, right? Maybe that was the only way they could get the towers that high that way? Ha.

    The steel could have been fine but was no match for thermite and whatever else they used to bring it down.

    1. different clue

      EVery line of inquiry may be helpful. I hope some people keep focusing on the who/what/why of the airplane attacks themselves. Who kept giving the “highjackers” money and support all through their stay in this country? Who brought them here and sheltered them here?

      Who stood down our air security on purpose to make sure those planes could get through to complete their part of the mission?

  28. Fiver

    Thanks for posting this Yves, clearly providing a lot of people an opportunity to have their say.

    It’s always of great interest to know where someone stands on this one – an issue where the public is far, far more ready to consider a different “truth” than their “opinion-makers” as to the essential character of senior elements their elites.

    But this article doesn’t entirely do that. It does suggest a real deviation from the Official Story, but crucially, it (so far) preserves that 1 vital Official Truth that is hardest to reconcile with everything else you now know – it had/has to be a total surprise attack with no participation by anyone OTHER than a (still)small gang of insane (but somehow broadly representative) America-hating terrorists. “Yeah, there might’ve been a post-attack coverup to hide the “embarrassment” to the Family Friends, along with an open-ended smashing of most of the countries on this here hit list Wolfie and the boys have been workin’ on since ’91, and a looting of most of the world’s economies, now that we’ve got that unlimited Executive Power, but there’s just no way WE’D do something like THAT to get here. No sir. Wouldn’t be prudent”. It begs 2 sets of questions:

    1) What DO you do with what are a very large number of reports from people who are not crazy exploring real contradictions, disputes of fact, reports of facts deliberately suppressed, established facts such as eye witness testimony suppressed, reports of men in vans dressed in Israeli military garb cheering the fall, of a million questions surrounding Building 7, the wanton destruction of evidence and much, much, much more? Some claims have been fully debunked, others not entirely convincingly. Others still stand, but more importantly, the still-accumulating stench of the whole thing, because everywhere you dig, you hit major dirt of some kind, just will not go away. The rankness is completely ignored by Officialdom, the job of non-refutation handed over long since to the Belief System Maintenance orthodoxy of opinion-makers to deal with via the blanket “conspiracy theory” quarantine procedure that awaits all those who dare broach that Forbidden Thought – that there are no shortage of nominal “our” guys perfectly capable of inflicting damage of this magnitude on their own citizens for reasons of money and/or power. There are too many theories. True. So what. That does NOT mean one, or some combination of them could not contain the truth. The existing official explanation has zero credibility. Impeachments for war crimes did not occur. This Admin expands, not limits, Executive Power even further. After what we’ve witnessed over the course of decades, the idea that discussion of alternatives would be scoffed at, rather than encouraged, is pretty friggin’ sad.

    2) Just think it again – WHO gets hit with a SURPRISE attack, finds out who did it, then at great risk and effort and amazing good luck, hides that fact and then flattens countries that had nothing to do with it? Isn’t it useful to be as apparently fumbling and bumbling and especially as “dumbling” as Reagan? I find some degree of involvement by actors other than Saudi terrorists at least as plausible as I do what the world has been told is the real goods.

    This was an ENORMOUS event. Aspects of it have really rankled for a good long time, something more than a merely “embarrassing” family problem. If something as important as the truth of that event, or of the election stolen before it, or the financial coup hand-off to Obama in 2008, to the whys and wherefores of the crises in Europe and with Iran – if examining any of these is the work of “conspiracy theorists” it’s only because so many journalists and academics have long since stopped doing their jobs. At some point the ability to even get at the truth is going to disappear completely if we just keep scarfing down so much of the official consensus that is excreta set before us “news” or “knowledge” of the world each and every day. What the public is presented with as the world, as reality, is utterly appalling.

    How many elite crimes can a society overlook before investigating elite crime becomes illegal or dangerous? Those pounding away should keep on doing so until justice is done – especially if that means compensating Iraq and Afghanistan because they had been used as decoys.

  29. Lorenzo Gabriano Dellaposta Jr.

    It is of great comfort to know that the poltical satans beginning in 63 our driven by financial gain will be no match to the growing militia which is driven by integrity & loyalty. Religion itself has no power and is fallen to the golden calf. The once powerful media has no more sway. There is only one truth that remains constant. In the END the good will defeat the evil.

  30. bartley residences

    I think this is among the such a lot significant info for me. And i am happy studying your article. But should commentary on some common things, The website taste is ideal, the articles is truly nice : D. Good process, cheers

Comments are closed.